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| Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch (1647086) | |
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Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by irtredbirdr33 on Tue Mar 3 14:01:54 2026 Tuscarora Almanac for March 3 and a Tuscarora Dispatch 1917 – from The Book of Last Runs The IRT White Plains Road Line is extended from East Tremont Avenue - West Farms Square to East 219th Street. 1981 – from The Book of First Runs The Metropolitan Transportation Authority creates the Metro-North Commuter Rail Division. This department will facilitate the takeover of the passenger train services operated by Conrail’s Metropolitan Region. Tuscarora Dispatch No 1 Track assignments at Queensboro Plaza Station 1916 - 1938 Queensboro Plaza was built as an eight track three level elevated station for joint use by both the Interborough Rapid Transit Company (IRT) and the Brooklyn Rapid Transit Company (BRT), later know as the Brooklyn Manhattan Transit Company (BMT). The lowest level was used for fare controls and a mezzanine. The next two levels were reserved for train operations. We shall call these the upper and lower levels. Each of these levels had four tracks and two island platforms. The upper level was for northbound trains (that is those trains running from Manhattan to Queens.), while the lower level was used for south or Manhattan-bound trains. The two north tracks on each level were for the use of the BRT (hereafter referred to as the BMT), while the two south tracks on each level were for the use of the IRT. Section A: Operations on BMT Tracks The north track of the BMT upper level was intended for use by BMT subway trains from Manhattan going to either the Astoria or Flushing Lines while the upper level south track was for trains from Manhattan going to the Crosstown Line. The north track of the BMT lower level was intended for use by trains from the Astoria or Flushing Lines going to Manhattan, while the lower level south track was intended for use by trains from the Crosstown Line going to Manhattan. At first it was intended that BMT trains would cross the East River on the Queensboro Bridge but this was later changed to the 60th Street Tunnel. The Crosstown Line was never built as a BMT Line although portions of it were later built as part of the IND Crosstown Line. Queensboro Plaza was never intended to be a terminal for the BMT and was built for through operation. The BMT did not begin operations from Manhattan to Queensboro Plaza until April 1, 1920 and by this time their subway car of choice was the BMT Standard which was 10 feet wide and 67 feet long which could not operate east of Queensboro Plaza because those lines had been built to IRT car specifications (9 feet wide, 52 feet long). For the next three years the BMT tried to figure out a way out of this dilemma even taking the IRT to court. During this interim period BMT trains operated to the north tracks on both levels since the south tracks (the ones for the Crosstown Line) had not been completed. Brighton Line trains used the upper level north track while 4th Avenue Line trains used the lower level north track. The trains reversed ends in the stations and used the diamond crossover on the ramp west of the station to switch tracks. The BMT finally decided to operate shuttle trains of BU Gate Cars between Queensboro Plaza and Ditmars Boulevard on the Astoria Line and 103 Street on the Flushing Line. This operation began on April 18, 1923. It should be noted that prior to 1928 when it was extended to Main Street the Flushing Line it was known as the Corona Line. Prior to the start of shuttle operation several changes were made to the track arrangement at Queensboro Plaza. BMT Subway trains from Manhattan would now use the south tracks on both levels, again with Brighton Line trains on the upper level and 4th Avenue trains on the lower level. The north tracks of each level would now be used by the El trains to Astoria and Corona. As there was no way to reverse the Astoria and Corona El Shuttles a diamond crossover was installed on the BMT Corona Lead Tracks east of Queensboro Plaza. A BMT El Shuttle from Astoria now arrived on the lower level north track and became the outbound Corona Shuttle. An inbound BMT El shuttle from Corona arrived on the upper level north track and became the outbound shuttle to Astoria. The BMT then constructed a switchback track for the subway trains running alongside of and south of the IRT tracks east of Queensboro Plaza Station. The upper level south track and the lower level south track were extended eastward to a junction with this new track. This switchback track was placed in service on July 17, 1924 and thereafter BMT Subway trains from Manhattan arrived on the upper level south track and departed from the lower level south track. This arrangement continued until 1938. Section B: Operations on IRT Tracks The north track of the IRT upper level was used by Queens-bound 2nd Avenue El trains bound for Astoria or Corona . The south track of the IRT upper level was used by Queensboro Subway trains bound for either Astoria or Corona and later Flushing. There was a diamond crossover east of the station so trains could switch to the appropriate routes. The north track of the IRT lower level was used by Manhattan-bound trains from the Astoria Line, both subway and el. The south track of the IRT lower level was used by Manhattan-bound trains from the Flushing Line, both subway and el . Again there was a diamond crossover west of the station so trains could switch to the appropriate route. The Queensboro Subway trains were the first to arrive at the new station on November 5, 1916. They arrived and departed from the IRT lower level south track single tracking back to Hunterspoint Avenue . IRT subway service to Astoria began on February 1, 1917. The Second Avenue El arrived at Queensboro Plaza on July 23, 1917 and began provided all service to Astoria on this date. IRT subway service to Astoria was restored on January 17, 1918. IRT subway service over the Flushing Line to 104 Street - Alburtis Avenue (today's 103 Street - Corona Avenue) began on April 21, 1917 followed by Second Avenue El service on January 17, 1918. Part 2 Track assignments at Queensboro Plaza Station 1939-1949 Section A: Operations on BMT Tracks The New York World's Fair of 1939-40 promised to be a major traffic and revenue generator on the jointly operated Flushing Line. Since 1923 the BMT had operated the Astoria and Flushing Shuttles as essentially a single route with a switchback at Queenboro Plaza. This meant that both lines had the same level of service. Since the Flushing Line would require additional service it would be necessary separate the two shuttles services. Trackage and switches east of Queensboro Plaza were re-arranged so that all BMT Flushing Line trains would now arrive and depart from the north track of the BMT lower level. BMT Astoria Line trains would now arrive and depart from the north track of the BMT upper level. All this work was done by April 10, 1939. Section B: Operations on IRT Tracks IRT operations continued as described above until June 13, 1942 when the Second Avenue El ceased operations. This meant that the north track of the IRT upper level was no longer needed for revenue service. However it was retained along with a stretch of track on the Queensboro Bridge as an emergency turn-back for Astoria and Flushing Line trains. Part 3 Track assignments at Queensboro Plaza Station 1949 - Now (2013) Section A: Operations on BMT Tracks The New York City Board of Transportation decided to end the joint operation of the Queens Lines in 1949. Hereafter the IRT Division would operate the Flushing Line and the BMT Division would operate the Astoria Line. All service would operate through the south or IRT half of the station. The north or BMT half of the station would be abandoned although some trackage would be retained for a period of time for non- revenue moves. Section B: Operations on IRT Tracks Queensboro Plaza Station would be essentially cut in half with only the south or IRT half remaining in use. As originally planned Queens - bound trains of both the IRT and BMT would arrive on the upper level whereas Manhattan - bound trains would arrive on the lower level. BMT trains from Manhattan would now arrive on the north track of the IRT upper level. This was the one formerly used by Queens - bound trains of the Second Avenue El. BMT trains to Manhattan would now use the north track of the IRT lower level. This one was formerly used by IRT trains from Astoria to Manhattan. As all service from Astoria would now be operated by the BMT Division the IRT had no need of it. Two assignments would remain unchanged. IRT Flushing Line subway trains would continue to use the south track of the IRT upper level while IRT trains from Queens to Manhattan would continue to use the south track of the IRT lower level. Section C: The Changeover. "IRT subway service to Astoria ended on July 24, 1949 and the IRT then began operation of BMT El cars (Q-Types) to and from the IRT half of the Queensboro Plaza Station. Southbound IRT shuttles would operate into the north track of the IRT lower level as IRT trains from Astoria had always done. They would then switchback using the remaining stretch of Second Avenue El trackage on the bridge. They would then leave the north track of the IRT upper level which had not seen regular service since 1942. Cars used in this service were marked "IRT LINES." (Source D.Rogoff 6/20/62). I do not know if this was done by temporary signage or stenciled on the sides of the cars. BMT Flushing Line Shuttles were discontinued just before midnight on Friday, October 13, 1949. Presumably the IRT Astoria shuttles were discontinued as well at this time. Over the weekend of October 15 - 16 the following schedule was in effect. BMT Brighton Locals were cut back to 57 Street - 7 Avenue. Fourth Avenue Locals were turned on the north track of the BMT lower level. (The one that had been used by BMT Flushing Line trains. The platform probably having been cut back in the interim.) A six car train of Q-Types ran as a shuttle between Ditmars Boulevard and Queensboro Plaza using the southbound track of the Astoria Line in both directions. This operation continued throughout the day on Saturday and until the late afternoon on Sunday During this time the platform edges on the northbound stations were cut back to clear the ten foot wide BMT subway cars. A six car trains of BMT Standards arrived at Astoria about five o'clock on Sunday consisted of (n) BX 2450-4025-2451 and B-Type 2536-2535-2534. The three south cars then began shuttle service on the northbound track while the platform edges on the southbound stations were cut back. also the BMT subway tracks from the 60 Street Tunnel were connected to the north tracks on the IRT half of the station. Regular operation of BMT subway trains to Astoria began on Monday morning, October 17, 1949 and continues as such until the time of this writing (October, 2013). The out of service platforms and trackage on the BMT half of the station were finally removed by March, 1963. (Source: B.Linder 5/92). Sources: 1) "A History of the Flushing and Astoria Lines" by Mr.David Rogoff, article , New York Division Bulletin February and August 1962. 2) "IRT Flushing Line" by Mr.Bernard Linder, article, New York Division Bulletin, December 1991, January, February and June 1992. 3) "The Track of New York", Number 3, Manhattan and Bronx Elevated Railroads 1920, by Mr.Alan Kahn and Mr.Jack May. 4) Electric Railroads No 23 - "New York Subways, Fifty Years of Millions" , October 1954 5) Electric Railroads No 25 - "New York El Lines 1867 - 1955" , December 1956 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by zac on Tue Mar 3 15:23:40 2026, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by irtredbirdr33 on Tue Mar 3 14:01:54 2026. I would make one addition, the crosstown trackways from the south side of both the BMT upper and lower levels were built and are still visible. The switchback track was added on top of these trackways and are also still visible. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by gbs on Tue Mar 3 16:19:24 2026, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by irtredbirdr33 on Tue Mar 3 14:01:54 2026. Queensboro Plaza, north side:      Demolition of north side, 1962:  The north track of the IRT upper level was used by Queens-bound 2nd Avenue El trains bound for Astoria or Corona. Abandoned trackway still visible: 
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Tue Mar 3 17:28:36 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by zac on Tue Mar 3 15:23:40 2026. Yep. Theyn had to keep the unused ironwork in place to support the remaining structure. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by murray1575 on Tue Mar 3 18:35:22 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by gbs on Tue Mar 3 16:19:24 2026. A minor correction: when the Flushing and Astoria lines were built in the Dual Contracts era the contracts required that both lines be built to allow BMT subway cars to operate over them. However the platforms and third rail clearances as built only allowed for IRT subway trains or IRT and BMT elevated trains to use them. This was the case until 1949 when the Astoria line was modified to allow BMT subway trains to be through routed at Queensboro Plaza using the former IRT Second Avenue platforms. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Q4 on Tue Mar 3 19:56:59 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by murray1575 on Tue Mar 3 18:35:22 2026. What was the “planned”alignment of the planned Crosstown route that would have utilized Queensboro Plaza? |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by zac on Wed Mar 4 08:52:02 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by Q4 on Tue Mar 3 19:56:59 2026. Down Jackson Ave, and mostly follow the route of the G train. It was to be built as an el but even then people objected to yet another el through Brooklyn. I had researched all of this a few years ago when I first took pics of the trackways leading toward Jackson, but "research" is just searching the internet. A lot of what I found were planning documents with a mention of wanting to build it, but only found a single mention of it in the early dual contracts. It was omitted in the later docs that were actually signed. My guess is that at the time of building the drawings still had the connection provision included and that's what was built. And of course it got built as part of the IND as a subway, not an el. The problem as it still exists is that the G train could not ever go to Manhattan from either end. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by irtredbirdr33 on Wed Mar 4 10:21:38 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by Q4 on Tue Mar 3 19:56:59 2026. What was the “planned”alignment of the planned Crosstown route that would have utilized Queensboro Plaza? The BMT "Crosstown" tracks were extended east of Queensboro Plaza in 1924. The two tracks past under the other tracks and ran parallel and to the south of the Corona bound local track. Thereafter BMT subway trains from Manhattan would discharge passengers on the upper level south track. They would then relay on the switchback track and pick up passengers on the lower level south track. In 1926 the BMT wanted to extend the switchback track and use the additional length for layups. The IRT then let them use 1250 feet of the Corona bound local track which ended in a bumper just west of 33rd Street station. In the middle 1930’s plans were put in place to increase service on the by then Flushing Line for the upcoming World’s Fair. There would now be express service on the Flushing Line so the IRT had to take backs the 1250 feet of trackage that the BMT was using for layups. Accordingly new steelwork was constructed to lengthen the switchback track. This extension was placed in service in March 1939. It is still possible to see the steelwork for the switchback track today. Again I am indebted to the late Mr. David Rogoff for his construction history of the IRT Flushing and Astoria Lines. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Mar 4 18:09:40 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by gbs on Tue Mar 3 16:19:24 2026. Those shots are all time historical shots |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by murray1575 on Thu Mar 5 13:52:04 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by gbs on Tue Mar 3 16:19:24 2026. Those are great pictures. There aren't many showing the station as it was built in the Dual Contracts era. Note that many of the R1 cars shown are from the first batch which didn't have reinforcing plates visible under the door sills. All the later cars had them. They were lent to the BMT after the war due to a shortage of AB Standard cars. A lot of equipment was not in good condition due to heavy use during the war years of gas rationing. As a result the BofT and its successor the TA purchased hundreds of new cars and made a lot of infrastructure improvements in the late 1940s through the 1950s. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Mar 5 18:31:59 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by murray1575 on Tue Mar 3 18:35:22 2026. The Flushing line west of QBP could never run BMT sized subway cars due the Steinway Tunnel. The clearances are so tight in that tunnel that even IRT cars can barely fit thru there. Timers abound there to keep the speeds lower so the equipment cant go too fast as to scrape the tunnel innards. . |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Q4 on Thu Mar 5 20:45:32 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by zac on Wed Mar 4 08:52:02 2026. Thanks. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Mar 5 22:52:11 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by zac on Wed Mar 4 08:52:02 2026. According to Peter Dougherty's "Tracks Of The New York City Subways", there are no trackways leading down towards Jacksom Ave on the EL structure. The only outside trackways were for the turning of BMT 10 ft wide trains that not yet went to Astoria. This trackway which is still visible today ran alongside the Flushing Line right up to Rawson St |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by murray1575 on Fri Mar 6 06:16:16 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by zac on Wed Mar 4 08:52:02 2026. While it is true that the G can never go directly into Manhattan it does have connections to lines that go directly there in both Brooklyn and Queens. The connection in Brooklyn is directly across the platform at Hoyt-Schermerhorn. To me it serves the purpose it was designed and built for. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch |
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Posted by murray1575 on Fri Mar 6 06:18:39 2026, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for March 34 and a Tuscarora Disdpatch, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Thu Mar 5 18:31:59 2026. I was referring to the lines east of QBP that were built after the Dual Contracts were signed. The Astoria line has been running BMT subway cars since October 1949. |
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