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| Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 (1641873) | |
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| (1641873) | |
Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by irtredbirdr33 on Fri Jun 13 07:54:23 2025 Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 1942 – from The Book of Last Runs The Board of Transportation discontinues service on the remaining sections of the 2nd Avenue Elevated Line. The following services ended on this day. 1) Operation of 2nd Avenue El trains on the IRT-BMT Flushing Line between Willets Point Boulevard and Queensboro Plaza. 2) Operation of 2nd Avenue El trains on the IRT-BMT Astoria Line between Ditmars Boulevard and Queensboro Plaza. Service on both of the above lines will be continued by IRT subway trains and BMT El car shuttles. 3) Operation and abandonment of the Queensborough Bridge Line between Queensboro Plaza and 57th Street - 2nd Avenue. 4) Operation of 2nd Avenue El trains on the 3rd Avenue Line between Chatham Square and South Ferry. Service to these stations will be continued by 3rd Avenue El trains. 5) Operation and abandonment of the 2nd Avenue Line between 57th Street and City Hall. The following stations are closed: 57th Street, 50th Street, 42nd Street, 34th Street, 23rd Street, 19th Street, 14th Street, 8th Street, First Street, Rivington Street, Grand Street, and Canal Street, Chatham Square and City Hall (Upper Level). Also abandoned was Chatham Square (Lower Level) on the mainline to South Ferry. Service to both Chatham Square and City Hall (Lower Level) will continue to be provided by 3rd Avenue El trains. The track layout and platforms at Chatham Square were confusing and bear some explanation. There were Chatham Square stations on both the South Ferry and City Hall branches. Each of these stations was served by both the 2nd and 3rd Avenue Els. The Chatham Square Station on the South Ferry Branch was a two level station with a single island platform and two tracks on each level. The upper level was served by the 3rd Avenue El while the lower level was served by the 2nd Avenue El. The actual junction of the two lines was some distance south just north of Franklin Square Station. Both the el lines had stations at Chatham Square and City Hall on the City Hall Branch. Although they shared the stations there was no track connection between the two els at these locations. At Chatham Square (C.H. Branch) there were two single island platforms each with two tracks side by side. The 3rd Avenue trains used the north platform and tracks while the 2nd Avenue El used the south platform and tracks. At City Hall there were two levels each with two tracks, one center platform and two side platforms. 2nd Avenue El trains used the upper level while 3rd Avenue El trains used the lower level. Again there was no track connection between the two els lines at this point. If a transfer move was necessary the train would operate to Franklin Square on the South Ferry Branch where there was a trailing point switch south of the station. This switch was removed on October 13, 1942. (For a modern day parallel see the operations of the BMT Culver and Brighton Lines at Coney Island and West 8th Street.) The final run was made by a six car trains of MUDC's. It left from South Ferry at about 9:30 PM and arrived at Astoria at 10:22 PM. The consist was 1763, 1779, 1664, 1801, 1759 and 1770. (This information was provided by Mr. Karl F. Groh who was a passenger on that train.) Sources: 1) New York Division Bulletin / October, 1992, article by Mr. Bernard Linder 2) "Farewell to the Second Avenue Elevated", July, 1990, article by Mr. Karl F. Groh 3) "New York El Lines 1867 / 1955", Electric Railroad No. 25, December, 1956 4) "The Tracks of New York, Number 3" by Mr. Alan Kahn and Mr. Jack May. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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| (1641874) | |
Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Fri Jun 13 14:15:32 2025, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for June 13, posted by irtredbirdr33 on Fri Jun 13 07:54:23 2025. And in hindsight was a mistake, though again, a lot of modernization would have had to have been done on the 2nd Avenue El to keep it running, including a rebuild that would include provisions to make it strong enough to handle 600' BMT-IND trains once the SAS was built with perhaps if so Phases 1-2 of the SAS reversed to account for having the 2nd Avenue EL gradually as new phases were done go into the Subway from the point such were ready to at the time. Same likely with the 3rd Avenue EL to allow SAS trains to eventually access the Bronx portion of that. |
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| (1641892) | |
Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by italianguyinsi on Sun Jun 15 11:14:22 2025, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13, posted by Wallyhorse on Fri Jun 13 14:15:32 2025. That is our tradgedy. Neither 2nd or 3rd were saved - and IIRC, 3rd was rebuilt to heavy duty standards and was still torn down.What could have been. |
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| (1641893) | |
Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Jun 15 12:57:28 2025, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13, posted by italianguyinsi on Sun Jun 15 11:14:22 2025. As I have noted before, they would have needed to rebuild 3rd Avenue during first the 1960's to handle more modern, heavier cars, possibly converting the entire line to BMT-IND standards and 600' stations to account for eventually an SAS line also using the 3rd Avenue EL in the Bronx, then after 9/11 rebuilding the line again to strengthen it following the attacks AND to handle NTT cars as by now the 3rd Avenue EL (and if still in place, the 2nd Avenue EL) would likely be CBTC along the full route.(Plus most notably, after 9/11 what would originally have been 59th-60th Streets on the 3rd Avenue EL becoming 60th-63rd Streets that would become on the 3rd Avenue EL easily the busiest station on the line with transfers on the south end at 60th to the 4/5/6/N/R/W and at 63td to the F/Q). |
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| (1641894) | |
Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Jun 15 13:31:23 2025, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13, posted by italianguyinsi on Sun Jun 15 11:14:22 2025. Only one section in the Bronx was built to Dual Contracts specs. In Manhattan, the express track was sort of built to heavy dity specs. I say sort of because the Qs could only operate on the middle track, and then had to deadhead in one direction. |
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| (1641895) | |
Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13 |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Sun Jun 15 14:32:31 2025, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for June 13, posted by Wallyhorse on Sun Jun 15 12:57:28 2025. It would have been nice to have one EL rebuilt with the Swiss Chalet style station architecture. While providing a vital mass transit option, it might have evolved into somewhat of a tourist attraction similar to the Loop in Chicago |
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