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| Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 (1601948) | |
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| (1601948) | |
Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022 Tuscarora Almanac - May 12, 1955 - The Book of Last Runs A Dark Day in Transit History Manhattan, New York New York City Transit Authority IRT Division This is May 12, 1955, a Thursday and one of the very dark days in the history of the New York City Transit System. It is the last day of service on the 3rd Avenue El between the 149th Street Station in The Bronx and the Chatham Square Terminal in Manhattan. The last train left from the Chatham Square Terminal at 6:00 PM. It consisted of six MUDC motor cars; 1662, 1778, 1753, 1780, 1668 and 1671. A Look Back May 12, 1955 was a sad, sad day for New Yorkers with the closure of the last of the Manhattan Els. The last train left Chatham Square a little after 6:00 PM and arrived at 149 Street about 7:15 PM, about 45 minutes late. The train consisted of six MUDC cars and was marshaled as follows; (n) 1662-1778-1753-1780-1668-1671 (s). It was crowded with railfans and other last riders. The 3 Avenue El originally extended from South Ferry north to 129 Street with a branch on 42 Street to Grand Central Depot and another branch on 34 Street to the East River. There was also a branch to City Hall. Service began between South Ferry and Grand Central on August 26, 1878 and was extended to 129 Street by December 30, 1878. The line north of 129 Street was built by the Suburban Railway Company and was actually the fifth el. It ran as far north as Bronx Park and its also had a branch that ran to the Willis Avenue Station of the NY,NH and Hartford Railroad. Due to the fact that this el ran along 3 Avenue between 149 Street and Fordham Road it quickly became identified with the Manhattan El of the same name even though it was also used by 2 Avenue El trains. Service from 129 Street north began on May 17, 1886 and reached 149 Street by June 16, 1887. At its peak 3 Avenue El trains ran all the way between East 241 Street-White Plains Road and South Ferry. With the closure of the southern portion of the 2 Avenue El on June 13, 1942 the 3 Avenue El became the last el line in Manhattan. (Except for the Polo Grounds Shuttle which made only on stop in Manhattan). It was the sad fate of the 3 Avenue El to suffer the death of 1,000 cuts. The branch lines went first. The 42 Street Spur closed on December 6, 1923, the Harlem River Branch on or about April 14, 1924 and the 34 Street Branch on July 14, 1930. The mainline itself was closed between Chatham Square and South Ferry on December 22, 1950 although the very last train may have run in the early am hours of December 23. On this date also all el trains where cut back to Gun Hill Road from East 241 Street. The spur between Fordham Road and Bronx Park closed on November 14, 1951 and the line between Chatham Square and City Hall closed on December 31, 1953. The surviving portion of the el in The Bronx between 149 Street and Gun Hill Road lasted until April 28, 1973. (The last regular train actually ran in the early hours of April 29.) Sources: ERA Headlights , July 1955 NYD Bulletins (various issues) ERA All-Time Map of IRT Routes My own records. Tuscarora Almanac May 12, 2015 The Book of Wrecks Philadelphia, Pennsylvania Amtrak Northeast Corridor Line Northeast Regional Train No. 188 derails at Frankford Junction. The engine and seven cars leave the tracks. Eight people are killed and two hundred injured. The engine, a brand new Cites Sprinter ACS-64 No. 601 was heavily damaged. The seven Amfleet coaches were 81528, 82776, 82644, 43346, 82761, 82797 and 82981. Source: ERA Bulletin /June 2015 Thanks to Bzuck for the consist information. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by zac on Thu May 12 08:07:38 2022, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022. "On May 13, 1955, the city started operation of the 2nd Ave subway that was to replace the dilapidated 2nd Ave and 3rd Ave els. Local trains ran from Wall St to 125th St, while express trains ran from South Ferry up to Gun Hill Road, using the 3rd Ave El in The Bronx until a new line could be extended up the Park Ave ROW. The shiny stainless steel R11 fleet made the express run through Manhattan in 18 minutes before going above ground and across the Harlem river. A modern subway has come to New York!"A headline that was never written, alas. |
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[PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:10 2022, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022. It is the last day of service on the 3rd Avenue El between the 149th Street Station in The Bronx and the Chatham Square Terminal in Manhattan. The last train left from the Chatham Square Terminal at 6:00 PM. It consisted of six MUDC motor cars; 1662, 1778, 1753, 1780, 1668 and 1671. Gun Hill Road or Chatham Square? 
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[PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:39 2022, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022. It is the last day of service on the 3rd Avenue El between the 149th Street Station in The Bronx and the Chatham Square Terminal in Manhattan. The last train left from the Chatham Square Terminal at 6:00 PM. It consisted of six MUDC motor cars; 1662, 1778, 1753, 1780, 1668 and 1671. Gun Hill Road or Chatham Square?
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Thu May 12 14:58:35 2022, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022. No need for that nasty old El when there'll be a bright shiny subway under Second Avenue any day now! |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Thu May 12 16:25:16 2022, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Peter Rosa on Thu May 12 14:58:35 2022. Sorry for the delay, folks! Seems someone impounded those 2nd Ave subway funding bonds. Those shiny new R-12's will be running under 2nd Ave soon! |
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Re: [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Thu May 12 17:03:02 2022, in response to [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:10 2022. It looks like Gun Hill Rd to me. |
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Re: [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Pelham Exp on Thu May 12 19:40:53 2022, in response to [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:10 2022. Agree with Bill here GUN Hill Rd |
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| (1602011) | |
Re: [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by VictorM on Fri May 13 01:48:02 2022, in response to [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:39 2022. Gun Hill Road. |
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3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 09:12:52 2022, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Thu May 12 06:51:19 2022. I've noted before on the 3rd Avenue how in hindsight it was a mistake to tear the line down, however, the line IMO would have had to undergo a complete rebuild so more modern cars could run on it that I suspect would have happened during the 1960's:Part of such a rebuild would have likely seen stations consolidated considerably from the original line as such stations would be built to handle 10 or 11-car trains of likely IRT cars as well. What had been the Park Row Branch of the 3rd Avenue EL would by this point have been moved to Chambers Street, terminating there first before twice being extended southward: First likely down Church Street to likely Vesey Street on the north end of the World Trade Center complex (with transfers to the 2/3/A/C/E and now R) and then likely around 1980-'81 or so further south to Battery Park City, as I would have done it with the line going down Church Street to Battery Place and from there going into what would eventually becomes Battery Park City, possibly finishing underground at a terminal that would have been within a yard built under the housing that would eventually be built there. This would have eventually replaced South Ferry as the main line and such would have been designated as line (8) while the South Ferry branch would have been designated line (9). There also would be a single track connection between the South Ferry and Battery Park City branches that could be used as a shuttle between the two branches there. The stations in consolidated form would likely have been like this (transfers are present day): Battery Park City Branch: Battery Park City/North Thames Street (Terminal) Battery Place/Greenwich Street Rector Street/Trinity Place (Transfer to R) World Trade Center (Transfer to 2/3/A/C/E/R) Chambers Street/City Hall (Transfer to 4/5/6/J/Z) South Ferry Branch: South Ferry (Terminal) Fulton Street Franklin Square Both: Chatham Square-Canal Street (Express, short-turn terminal) Grand Street (Transfer to B/D) Houston Street St. Mark's Place (8th Street) 14th Street (Express, Transfer to (L) 23rd Street 34th Street 42nd Street (Express, Transfer to 4/5/6/7/S) 53rd Street (Express, Transfer to 6/E/M) 60th Street (Express, Transfer to 4/5/6/N/R/W) 72nd Street 79th Street 86th Street (Express) 96th Street 106th Street 116th Street 125th Street (Express and last stop in Manhattan, 129th Street would be eliminated) The Bronx Portion would remain as is though some stations would likely have been consolidated as well. There would likely have been a second rebuild of the line after 9/11 to strengthen the line and also allow for much heavier NTT trains and make the line much quieter as a rule). Most notable of such a rebuild would have been where 60th Street, which initially would have exits at 59th and 60th would be moved north to where it would cover 60th to 63rd Streets and transfers noted at 60th plus the F/Q now to the north on the 63rd Street end. I also noted before as part of a second rebuild post-9/11, a third branch could be added that would have been the World Financial Center (now Brookfield Place) branch that would have mainly served there and Battery Park City North and would have been designated line (10). This line would have run with the Battery Park City Branch along Worth Street before continuing along Worth west to Hudson and then a half-block north to Harrison to West, then along West to Brookfield Place where it would terminate. This would have operated all times except late nights where it would operate as a shuttle between Brookfield Place and Chatham Square. |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun May 15 12:20:36 2022, in response to 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 09:12:52 2022. LOL! |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Italianstallion on Sun May 15 12:23:36 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun May 15 12:20:36 2022. He has a lot of time on his hands. |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 13:10:30 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Italianstallion on Sun May 15 12:23:36 2022. This was actually rather simple and took hardly any time to figure out. Most of it in putting it together were no-brainers. |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sun May 15 13:16:37 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 13:10:30 2022. LOL! |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sun May 15 13:39:32 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Italianstallion on Sun May 15 12:23:36 2022. I think he has else IN his hands! A lot of Wally's fantasies remind me of my Catholic high school Latin verbs: masterbo, masturbare, masturbavi, masturbatus. |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Sun May 15 15:40:08 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by Elkeeper on Sun May 15 13:39:32 2022. Give Wally credit. He has an active imagination. At least he keeps his posts on topic. If I had my way I'd tear down those townhouses in Brooklyn and bring back the single track Culver shuttle with the Bocce ball courts. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL |
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Posted by William A. Padron on Sun May 15 16:10:12 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Sun May 15 15:40:08 2022. Give Wally credit. He has an active imagination. At least he keeps his posts on topic.And with an empty pocketbook as to how for pay it (not with his money, that is for sure), and without a projected timeline and actual costs to finish his "fantasy transit ideals". -William A. Padron ["Piece Of The Sky"] |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL/Culver Shuttle |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 18:51:36 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL, posted by William A. Padron on Sun May 15 16:10:12 2022. I was in this case doing a historical perspective on how I think it would have gone, especially since the MTA likely would have for example after 9/11 gotten a ton of money for the specific purpose of rebuilding what almost certainly would have been (in this scenario) the destroyed portion of the Battery Park City branch of the 3rd Avenue EL as well as likely given money to build a new branch to what is now Brookfield Place.As for the idea if the former Culver Shuttle route, I'd simply move the ROW to the street where and if possible and if necessary build such with two levels of single track, doing it where at Ditmas Avenue, a new upper level is built on the northbound side (with a new track added south of Ditmas that breaks off from the current southbound track and goes uphill to this new upper level), using a new bridge just north of the station to go to the main rebuilt line while on the southbound side, the island platform that was there in the shuttle days is brought back, but with the intent that trains continue in both directions to/from Coney Island with that track continuing and connecting south of Ditmas to the main Southbound track. This would be a way to bring Broadway Line service to the Culver line in the form of the (W) running to Coney Island via 4th Avenue, going with the (D) before going to the lower level of 9th Avenue and then going via a rebuilt connection to the Culver Line. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 16 02:59:25 2022, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Elkeeper on Thu May 12 16:25:16 2022. Not R-12, R-11s. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 16 15:07:12 2022, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by randyo on Mon May 16 02:59:25 2022. Mea, R-11's! My bad! |
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Re: 3rd Avenue EL/Culver Shuttle |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 16 15:13:05 2022, in response to Re: 3rd Avenue EL/Culver Shuttle, posted by Wallyhorse on Sun May 15 18:51:36 2022. Masturbo, masturbas, masturbat, masturbamos, masturbatis, masturbant! |
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Re: [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12 |
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Posted by murray1575 on Mon May 16 19:25:43 2022, in response to [PHOTO] Re: Tuscarora Almanac for May 12, posted by Bill Newkirk on Thu May 12 13:51:10 2022. It has to be Gun Hill Road. At Chatham Square the 3rd Ave. line was on the upper level so there would be nothing above the train. Gun Hill Road was one of the two places on the system where elevated trains used a platform at a lower level than that of the subway line they connected with. |
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