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| Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni (1561706) | |
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| (1561706) | |
Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Nov 19 12:16:04 2020 Bad ballast |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Thu Nov 19 19:02:14 2020, in response to Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Nov 19 12:16:04 2020. I wonder if the used a ballast regulator back when all this work was being done?Hmmm! |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Nov 20 02:50:44 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Thu Nov 19 19:02:14 2020. whatever they did, the work was sloppy at best,crooked more likele. IMHO, unless you wantto believe that SFMTA is corrupt internally--entirely possible--they are at the very least incapable of policing the contractors who get the bids and then f up the work. And, given the "lowest competent bidder" legal constraints, the low ball specialist currently trying for the Chinatown Station job has only overrun 11 jobs by 40% since 2000 according to a recent article.The idea that a worker death--ipso facto mgmt responsibility--only cost Shimmick $63k instead of putting them out ofbusiness shows how little we care about people. |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Nov 21 00:02:49 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Nov 20 02:50:44 2020. Instead of ballast it would have been better to use the type II concrete roadbed with short wooden ties like the MTA has been doing recently and the B of T did for years. |
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| (1561782) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sat Nov 21 02:04:13 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Fri Nov 20 02:50:44 2020. IMHO, unless you want to believe that SFMTA is corrupt internally—entirely possibleMerely "possible"? |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Sat Nov 21 07:36:02 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 21 00:02:49 2020. Concrete roadbeds are much noisier than rock ballast. There are maximum noise specs that might be exceeded.There are also machines that can tamp rock ballast for much lower cost maintenance. NYCT didn't use them. Tokyo does. It's one of many areas where the B of T did for years NYCT has blinders regarding technology that came online after 1932. |
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| (1561827) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Nov 21 17:58:24 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by randyo on Sat Nov 21 00:02:49 2020. HBut hw would recurring patronage contracts continue if they did that?They faked this one a year ago;mow they admit they have to fix it. |
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| (1561828) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Nov 21 18:00:26 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Olog-hai on Sat Nov 21 02:04:13 2020. meaning pervasively. I am acquainted with both current and previous personnel that I do not consider corrupt sso much asmisguided. |
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| (1561888) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Nov 22 17:29:53 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Stephen Bauman on Sat Nov 21 07:36:02 2020. The noise problem could be dealt with by using cushioned tie plates like NYCTA uses. |
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| (1561900) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 22 18:26:00 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by randyo on Sun Nov 22 17:29:53 2020. What's the relative expense versus longevity? |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by randyo on Mon Nov 23 01:15:13 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Olog-hai on Sun Nov 22 18:26:00 2020. IMHO, the ties imbedded in concrete last longer and require less maintenance that ballast and definitely last longer since the iND’s roadbed is pretty much completely intact as opposed to the older portions of the IRT which has had the ballast replaced several times. The initial higher cost would be offset by not having to replace the roadbed every so often. |
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Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Nov 23 07:22:39 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by randyo on Sun Nov 22 17:29:53 2020. using cushioned tie platesOne problem is that the cushioning becomes brittle, looses its elasticity, and hence its noise elimination capability. The effectiveness of the cushioning is much less than either the concrete or rock ballast. It's not replaced, so the noise returns to injurious levels. |
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| (1561940) | |
Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Mon Nov 23 15:31:29 2020, in response to Re: Twin Peaks Tunnel. SF Muni, posted by Stephen Bauman on Mon Nov 23 07:22:39 2020. interesting. Muni put a large "sheet" of noise dampener inthetrenchfor the F Market Line where it turns off Market onto Noe Street. As this was done 20+years ago, one might expect complaint fromthe neighbors. None AFAIK |
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