|
|
| Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station (1535102) | |
 |
|
| Home > SubChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
|
|
| (1535104) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 18:47:24 2020, in response to Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Mitch45 on Sat Jan 11 18:28:26 2020. 7th Ave is unique. Stillwell has a different unique attribute. Northbound trains exit the station in both directions, though not at the same platform.Hoyt Schermerhorn has northbound Gs running in the opposite direction from northbound As, but not at the same platform. |
|
|
| (1535106) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by andy on Sat Jan 11 18:53:38 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 18:47:24 2020. At Stillwell, between November 1967 and April 1968, there was the unique NX train, which began at Brighton Beach in the AM peak, traveled SB to Stillwell, then became NB at that location.Then there is today's M train which begins at Metropolitan Ave as as SB train and becomes NB after Essex St. The same thing occurs when it leaves Forest Hills on a return trip. But neither one is the same as the unique 7th Ave. Station layout. |
|
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
|
| (1535115) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:07:46 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 18:47:24 2020. The Broadway El between Myrtle and Marcy has another interesting arrangement: Northbound and southbound trains stop at the same platforms in the same direction of travel (e.g. a southbound J going to Broad Street and a northbound M going to Continental both stop at the Manhattan-bound platform). That doesn't seem to be a unique oddity, too. |
|
|
| (1535116) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:09:17 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by andy on Sat Jan 11 18:53:38 2020. I thought Forest Hills was always the north term for an M, and Metropolitan the south term. |
|
|
| (1535117) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by ro_jo on Sat Jan 11 20:27:33 2020, in response to Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Mitch45 on Sat Jan 11 18:28:26 2020. This station is also unique in that on the "Uptown" platform, trains operate "UK-Style"/"Drive-on-the-left"-Robj |
|
|
| (1535118) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 20:45:45 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by ro_jo on Sat Jan 11 20:27:33 2020. Again different, but under CPW, northbound locals drive on the left.And in New Rochelle, southbound Amtrak trains always stop on the northbound express track. |
|
|
| (1535119) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Jan 11 20:46:42 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 20:45:45 2020. So? In that case it’s like a one way street. |
|
|
| (1535120) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by andy on Sat Jan 11 20:47:33 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:09:17 2020. True, but a train between Metropolitan Ave. and Essex St. was traditionally a SB move, and of course from Essex to Metropolitan was NB, to be consistent with the Jamaica El trains. |
|
|
| (1535127) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 21:05:09 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Jan 11 20:46:42 2020. Yes, an unusual one-way street with the fast lane on the right.Quite a digression from the OP, of course. |
|
|
| (1535135) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 11 21:27:57 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by andy on Sat Jan 11 20:47:33 2020. How many times to I have to post this? Prior to Chrystie, The rule was that trains passing through Brooklyn enroute Manhattan were NORTHBOUND regardless of the point of origin. All the outer Eastern Division terminals were SOUTH terminals. When the QJ was established in 1967, it was decided to make the entire route southbound towards Stl to eliminate confusion. The JJ, KK and M were still classed as northbound towards Manhattan. When the M was routed to Stl and the J truncated at Broad St at all times the M became southbound lvg met but the J was never changed back and the K remained northbound towards Manhattan. Now that the M has been routed to Manhattan kit has been returned to its proper designation as NORTHBOUND lvg Met and SOUTHBOUND towards Met. The track numbers bear this out since on the BMT and IND, southbound tracks have odd numbers and northbound tracks have even numbers and that is how the Eastern Division tracks are numbered. The A Line which operated over former BMT trackage to Lefferts is for a brief portion physically north going towards Lefferts but since the A is a southbound service lvg 207 St it remains a southbound train for its entire length. The proper thing for the NYCT to do would be to reclassify the J as northbound towards Broad St the way it was pre Chrystie and the way it should be!!!! That way all trains operating on Broadway Bkln would be perfectly matched. |
|
|
| (1535136) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 11 21:28:22 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:07:46 2020. See my post! |
|
|
| (1535137) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sat Jan 11 21:29:25 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 20:45:45 2020. Thye IRT E/Pkwy Line is the same way between Utica and Nostrand. |
|
|
| (1535138) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 11 21:56:22 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 11 21:27:57 2020. There are always new folks who don't know north from south. |
|
|
| (1535143) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Jan 11 23:11:16 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:07:46 2020. These distinctions,of course are internal while riders simply seek Uptown or Downtown, etc. In Boston the Red line is signed Inbound in both directions toward the CBD from the South and North terminals. |
|
|
| (1535144) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Jeff Rosen on Sat Jan 11 23:19:42 2020, in response to Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Mitch45 on Sat Jan 11 18:28:26 2020. I was thinking Stillwell when the NX Super Express was running, then I realized the Brighton terminated there and didn't go further North. |
|
|
| (1535150) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Sun Jan 12 01:14:39 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 11 21:56:22 2020. Well now they can read my post and find out. |
|
|
| (1535155) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Sun Jan 12 03:03:09 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by randyo on Sun Jan 12 01:14:39 2020. No, your post is so jammed together it's not really readable. The paragraph was invested for a reason.And besides, many of us who are not transit employees don't care what NYCT calls north and south and prefer to stick with actual directions. To many of us the L and the 7 have east and west directions, not north and south. And referring to Metropolitan Ave as south of Essex Street is not useful. |
|
|
| (1535158) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Train Dude on Sun Jan 12 07:30:56 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sun Jan 12 03:03:09 2020. So typical. |
|
|
| (1535161) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Jan 12 08:08:24 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Train Dude on Sun Jan 12 07:30:56 2020. And so many posters want to show they more than "us". What a contradiction this is ! |
|
|
| (1535166) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Jan 12 09:00:25 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Andrew Saucci on Sat Jan 11 21:56:22 2020. Or up from down.:) |
|
|
| (1535167) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Jan 12 09:01:33 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by JayZeeBMT on Sat Jan 11 20:07:46 2020. The Three Stooges Division is topsy-turvy.:) |
|
|
| (1535168) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Jan 12 09:02:38 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by ro_jo on Sat Jan 11 20:27:33 2020. Uptown trains appear to be operating lefthanded at 7th Ave., yes. |
|
|
| (1535169) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sun Jan 12 09:03:36 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Sat Jan 11 20:45:45 2020. The CPW tunnels were built that way to allow passengers to embark and disembark on the west side of CPW. |
|
|
| (1535214) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 13 00:55:39 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by randyo on Sat Jan 11 21:27:57 2020. So now I know why tracks next to each other on 4 track lines don't have consecutive numbers.How come certain 2 track segments don't start at track 1 (like the Brighton line at Atlantic). |
|
|
| (1535215) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 13 00:59:58 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Sat Jan 11 23:11:16 2020. Check Subway Time for J/M stations."Uptown" (J) Jamaica Center (M) Forest Hills "Downtown" (J) Broad Street (M) Metropolitan Ave. |
|
|
| (1535219) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 13 02:50:51 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 13 00:55:39 2020. Tracks on branch lines often retain the same numbers that they had on their trunk lines where the branch lines are direct extensions of those trunk lines. The Wash Hts Line of the IND retains the “A” track chaining all the way from 207 St to Euclid. The Concourse line which is not a part of the main 8 Av/CPW Line has its own line designations and track numbers which is “C.” The IRT uses an entirely different tk numbering scheme. There are 2 tk numbering systems on the IRT. MOW numbers S/B tks with even numbers and N/B tks with odd numbers just the opposite of the BMT and IND Also the exp tks have the lower numbers while the lcl tks have the higher numbers again the opposite of the BMT and IND. RTO merely numbers the tks 1,2,3, and 4 from west to east but then the branch lines get a bit tricky. 3 tk lines don't number the middle track referring to such a tk simply as “M tk.” On the Bway and Jerome branches the tks are numbered 1,4 and of course M. The Lenox/Wh Pl Rd branch is numbered 2,3 (and M on the 3 tk portions of the line). The tks on the 148 St branch of the Lenox are numbered 1 and 4. The Pelham branch is numbered 2,3 and M. In Bkln, the E/Pky line has the full 1 through 4 tk numbering to Utica. Utica to N/Lts tks are numbered 1 and 4 while the nostrand Av branch tks are numbered 2 and 3. Free standing 2 and 3 tk lines that are not branches of a 4 tk trunk line are merely numbered 1 and 2 with M where applicable like the Flushing line and the former Manhattan els. As you can see the NYCTS track numbering system can be a bit confusing even for the more knowledgable buff. As an addendum to the aforementioned, the Dyre Av Line tks are numbered IND style since when it was first opened by the B of T it was operated as part of the IND despite using IRT cars and being shown as an IRT line on the Hagstrom maps. It was done partially because the purchase negotiations were started before unification so it would have logically been an IND line and also because the line’s acquisition provided the B of T with a possible Bronx branch to the SAS which was still under consideration well into the 1970s before the city’s fiscal crisis. |
|
|
| (1535246) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Mon Jan 13 12:25:41 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by N6 Limited on Mon Jan 13 00:59:58 2020. With a "C" shaped route, even east and west bound for the M train would not make sense to M line passengers. |
|
|
| (1535282) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Mon Jan 13 18:23:41 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Joe V on Mon Jan 13 12:25:41 2020. The logic behind the Eastern Div being N/B towards Manhattan is that if and when any possible connections were built to existing or future BMT lines in Manhattan they would be going physically northbound as is the case with the Fulton St el connection to the IND, the K/KK lines up 6 Av or the current configuration of the M going N/B up 6 Ave to Queens. While we are on the subject of trains having both terminals in the same borough while passing through Manhattan, when the E was running to the Rockaways it started and ended in Queens as the M presently does. |
|
|
| (1535324) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by MainR3664 on Tue Jan 14 07:44:58 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by randyo on Mon Jan 13 18:23:41 2020. And, similarly to today's M (Metropolitan Ave and 71-Continental) are 3 miles apart) , the E's Queens terminals weren't that far from one another. My 1967 Chrystie map shows some E trains going to Lefferts- practically a stone's throw from Hillside Avenue.Now, if they ran the E from Parsons/Archer to Lefferts, that would be remarkable. Another remarkable thing about the 1956-76 E was that in terms of distance, more than 50% of its route was the rush hour extension. Assuming the M resumes its normal pattern after the L job is done, that will be almost the same- the weekday extension is about 75% of the routes length. Prior to 2013, I'd say it was over 90%! |
|
|
| (1535329) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Tue Jan 14 10:25:49 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by MainR3664 on Tue Jan 14 07:44:58 2020. Assuming the M resumes its normal pattern after the L job is doneHopefully the M will continue to go beyond Essex on weekends once the L job is done. If nothing else, NYC has a lot more tourists than it had 20 years ago when they moved the Q from 6th Ave to Broadway - and tourists use 6th Ave a lot. And 96th/2nd can use a bit more service to midtown on the weekends. And lower Williamsburgh is more heavily populated than it used to be - it could use a service to midtown on the weekends. |
|
|
| (1535348) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Jan 14 14:21:34 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by AlM on Tue Jan 14 10:25:49 2020. Don't bet on it with CBTC installation and all these other assorted GO's.Once they start the 8th Ave. CBTC installation and testing, 8th Ave. trains will have to be sent over 6th Ave. Therefore there will be no room for the M. |
|
|
| (1535371) | |
Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Tue Jan 14 17:13:25 2020, in response to Re: Question About 7th Avenue - 53rd Street Station, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Jan 14 14:21:34 2020. Unless they can figure out a way to make non NTTs CBTC compatible it will be some time before CBTC is extended beyond the lines where it is currently planned. |
|
|
