GC-TS Shuttle observations

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GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019 Construction has begun and the middle track is now permanently out of service. There are platform conductors directing riders to either track 1 or track 4 (a pain in the neck at Times Sq). Both trains have only three cars. The train I rode on track 1 consisted of (E)1921-1922-1925(W). These are former Flushing cars that are coupled, not linked, together. Both end cars have transverse cabs (which is why they're not using 1923 and 1924 as end cars). Being from Flushing, they have illuminated circles and diamonds on their side signs, and the red diamonds were lit. Why? In fact, why are these cars with the circles and diamonds used on the shuttle at all? They should all be assigned to the #6 where the circles and diamonds are meaningful and helpful. Is it because they're the only non-linked cars around, and can form three-car trains?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Bill Newkirk* on Tue Sep 10 06:56:03 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* Both trains have only three cars. Rush hour should be interesting. Bill Newkirk
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Tue Sep 10 08:12:27 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* I wouldn't say Tk 3 is "permanently" out of service. It may be back in service soon.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Mitch45* on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* Any indication that the open west end of the TS station is being walled off?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Broadway Lion* on Tue Sep 10 11:17:50 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019.* I should certainly hope not, it is too much fun to watch trains from there. ROAR
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by AlM* on Tue Sep 10 11:28:46 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019.* I sometimes enter the TSQ station at 43rd and Bway but haven't for a few weeks. I'll look again next time I'm there.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by IRTRedbirdR33* on Tue Sep 10 12:33:25 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* Construction has begun and the middle track is now permanently out of service. There are platform conductors directing riders to either track 1 or track 4 (a pain in the neck at Times Sq). Both trains have only three cars. If the plan is to use only two tracks they should use them in one direction only, track 1 eastbound and track 4 westbound. This was done after the 1964 fire. The narrow platform on track 4 causes dangerous crowding conditions even when all three tracks are in use. Larry, RedbirdR33
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by AlM* on Tue Sep 10 12:36:55 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Tue Sep 10 12:33:25 2019.* If the plan is to use only two tracks they should use them in one direction only, track 1 eastbound and track 4 westbound. Huh? Now you've got your capacity in half again, having just cut it by a third by closing down track 3.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by gbs* on Tue Sep 10 15:37:56 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019.* No, it's still open and you can see the trains passing by. They've screened off the entire track 3 platform and track.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Sep 10 17:30:28 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* Is it impossible to platform 4-car trains on the 2 remaining tracks at both ends of the line ?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by IRTRedbirdR33* on Tue Sep 10 17:37:26 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Joe V on Tue Sep 10 17:30:28 2019.* Is it impossible to platform 4-car trains on the 2 remaining tracks at both ends of the line ? You could not do this at the Times Square end because of the length of the platforms and the gap-fillers. Larry, RedbirdR33
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by R42ToMoffat* on Tue Sep 10 17:49:19 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* I still don’t get why they can’t make a huge wall of glass that’ll let you view the IRT Broadway-7th Avenue Line...
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Mitch45* on Tue Sep 10 17:52:39 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Sep 10 11:17:50 2019.* Not only that, but there’s a lot of history at that track merge. It shows the original 1904 alignment of the IRT. You can clearly see how the locals and expresses passed through the station en route uptown. It’s living history.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by AlM* on Tue Sep 10 18:14:06 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019.* I took a look. So far, nothing has changed at the far western end, west of the platforms. But eventually that is all supposed to get closed off.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Sep 10 18:23:53 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by AlM on Tue Sep 10 18:14:06 2019.* I suppose much like the LIRR Atlantic Terminal. Nobody could tell on the LIRR side anymore than one of the trackways punched through to the subway.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Bill from Maspeth* on Tue Sep 10 18:40:16 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by R42ToMoffat on Tue Sep 10 17:49:19 2019.* Wouldn't stay clean due to subway grime/steel dust in the air.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Tue Sep 10 18:59:51 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Joe V on Tue Sep 10 18:23:53 2019.* No, not like that. You'll still be able to tell.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Tue Sep 10 19:01:01 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 10:38:26 2019.* Yes - the project plans. But it won't be completely walled off, as the connection to the west side IRT will be maintained.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Tue Sep 10 19:02:08 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Mitch45 on Tue Sep 10 17:52:39 2019.* Yep, it sure is!
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Sep 10 19:03:52 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Tue Sep 10 18:59:51 2019.* They got the glazed brick wall, so I found it hard to tell. Of course I remember what it was like before.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP* on Tue Sep 10 19:05:29 2019, in response to GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by gbs on Tue Sep 10 04:31:41 2019.* I still say they should join 1956 with its four sequential mates, 1957-60. And put 1951-53-55 in the same shuttle consist.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Tue Sep 10 19:06:56 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Joe V on Tue Sep 10 19:03:52 2019.* No, not there. I'm taking about at Times Square.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Joe V* on Tue Sep 10 19:08:53 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Tue Sep 10 19:06:56 2019.* OK
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Tue Sep 10 19:52:25 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Tue Sep 10 08:12:27 2019.* AFAIK track 3 will never be returned to service.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Tue Sep 10 19:57:14 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Tue Sep 10 19:01:01 2019.* It may be walled off as far as what passengers may be able to see. Don’t forget the entire new T/Sq platform will be start at what is now the east end of the existing platforms in order to get it off the curve so track 4 in the area of the existing station may be behind a false wall.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Tue Sep 10 19:58:50 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Tue Sep 10 12:33:25 2019.* After track 3 is completely platformed over, the remaining platform will definitely be wide enough.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Tue Sep 10 20:00:02 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 10 18:40:16 2019.* Not only that but do you think that the MTA REALLY care about railfans?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Tue Sep 10 20:00:21 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 10 18:40:16 2019.* Not only that but do you think that the MTA REALLY care about railfans?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Broadway Lion* on Wed Sep 11 10:34:31 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 20:00:21 2019.* Yes, I do. They are pax paying money and they are treated with the same respect and care as given to any customer. ROAR
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Broadway Lion* on Wed Sep 11 10:35:49 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Sep 10 19:05:29 2019.* With a two track terminal in the north and a two track terminal in the south, they could easily run three train sets at a time.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Michael549* on Wed Sep 11 12:26:11 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 11 10:35:49 2019.* Why add in the extra complexity of additional switch tracks and home-balls, when the TA could easily have just two trains running back and forth, alone on their single tracks? Mike
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by MainR3664* on Wed Sep 11 14:35:43 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Joe V on Tue Sep 10 18:23:53 2019.* Except that I think the track connection to the West Side IRT will remain- but probably out of sight to the public....
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Mitch45* on Wed Sep 11 15:12:06 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Tue Sep 10 19:02:08 2019.* The MTA has a tin ear when it comes to things like that, though.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Wed Sep 11 17:00:05 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Sep 11 10:34:31 2019.* The MTA doesn’t care any more about railfans that it does about any other ordinary passenger or else they would have set up the OPTO on the NTTs with corner cabs with closed circuit TV cameras and proper RFWs like the M/F cars in Philly.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by randyo* on Wed Sep 11 17:17:56 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by MainR3664 on Wed Sep 11 14:35:43 2019.* That’s what I alluded to in my post.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 19:36:04 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 19:52:25 2019.* Totally possible. Plans can always change.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 19:39:52 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 19:57:14 2019.* Can't be a false wall if they need to move trains in and out.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 19:41:43 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Tue Sep 10 12:33:25 2019.* The narrow platform on Tk 4 seems to be a solvable issue - demolish the rooms built along that platform and restore the full original width!!!!
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Michael549* on Wed Sep 11 20:02:51 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 19:57:14 2019.* At Grand Central Station one of the shuttle tracks leads directly to the downtown local #6 track. From the platform view most riders do not even notice that there is a pathway for the shuttle train to travel anywhere. The same would be the case at Times Square after the renovation work. https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?146729 https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?130101 https://www.nycsubway.org/perl/show?109610
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 20:53:27 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Broadway Lion on Tue Sep 10 11:17:50 2019.* Enjoy it while you can. They're planning to close off the whole area.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 20:53:30 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 19:52:25 2019.* When the work is done, track 3 will be removed but I don't know if they're planning to return it to service temporarily while they take another track out of service for other work. From what I could tell, they're starting to build the new platform in the space where track 2 used to be, and track 3 is out of service to stage work trains and build that platform. Signs have suggested track 3 may be temporarily returned to service starting in October. We'll see.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 20:53:32 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Tue Sep 10 12:33:25 2019.* They're planning to build a new, wide platform between tracks 1 and 4 just east of the current station.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 20:53:34 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by R42ToMoffat on Tue Sep 10 17:49:19 2019.* They're planning to close off the whole area.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Wed Sep 11 20:59:18 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by randyo on Tue Sep 10 19:58:50 2019.* And in any event the platform that presently serves track 4 will be abandoned.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 22:40:25 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Michael549 on Wed Sep 11 20:02:51 2019.* Correct.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 22:45:51 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 11 20:53:27 2019.* No, not the whole area. As I said, the Tk 4 connection will remain open.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 22:46:24 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 11 20:53:30 2019.* Isn't that what I said?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by TerrApin Station* on Wed Sep 11 22:47:00 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by Nilet on Wed Sep 11 20:53:34 2019.* No, not the whole area. As I said, the Tk 4 connection will remain open.
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 23:22:15 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Wed Sep 11 22:46:24 2019.* I don't know. Did you?
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Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations
Posted by Nilet* on Wed Sep 11 23:22:17 2019, in response to Re: GC-TS Shuttle observations, posted by TerrApin Station on Wed Sep 11 22:45:51 2019.* Track 4 will remain connected to the west side mainline but the area surrounding that connection will be closed off to passengers. Accordingly, Broadway Lion will no longer be able to watch passing trains from the open west end of the station because, as I said, the entire area will be closed off.
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