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| Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 (1487333) | |
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| (1487333) | |
Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018 Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1919 – The Book of First and Last Runs Manhattan, New York New York Railways Service comes to an end on four crosstown trolley lines operated by New York Railways; No. 1 Avenue C, No. 11 Sixth Avenue – Ferry, No. 12 Madison & Chambers Streets and No. 14 Spring & Delancey Street. Bus service begins on the same day Here is the full story. New York Railways which was in bankruptcy received permission to discontinue four low ridership storage battery lines. Mayor Hylan instructed the Department of Plants and Structures (which also controlled the city’s bridges and ferries) to issue permits to independent bus operators on routes authorized by the city. Permits were issued for three of the four routes: No. 1 Madison & Chambers Streets, No. 2 Spring & Delancey Streets and No. 3 Avenue C. Bus service began on Sunday, September 21, 1919, the same day that the streetcar service ended. This event marks the beginning of the city operated bus system that we have today. DP&S Route 1 Madison & Chambers Street Crosstown eventually became the M-1 and in 1974 was re-numbered to M-22. This route is still in service (2016). DP&S Route 2 Spring & Delancey Streets was designated Route 12 in 1936 and M-12 in 1974. It was discontinued on October 26, 1979. DP&S Route 3 Avenue C is better described as the Houston Street – Avenue C Crosstown. It became the M-10 in 1929 when the Hamilton Bus Corporation took over its operation. It became Route 21 in 1940 when New York City Omnibus replaced Hamilton. Probably in 1974 in became known as the M-21. Effective on June 27, 2010 it was split into two separate routes. The M-9 Avenue C bus runs between 29th Street and City Hall via Avenue C, Essex Street and Park Row. The M-21 Houston Street Crosstown runs between Washington Street and the FDR Drive. Note 1: New York Railways cars did not carry route numbers. They did show the numbers on paper transfers and these are the ones that I have used. Note 2: The routes authorized by the DP&S were assigned numbers in the order of creation regardless of where the buses operated. They were not carried on the buses. Later when the Board of Transportation took over this function they began the use of borough prefixes. Sources: 1) “Old New York”, Motor Coach Age January – June 2013, article by Mr. Eli Bail. 2) New York Division Bulletin / various issues, article by Mr. Bernard Linder 3) “From a Nickel to a Token” (Fordham University Press /2015) by Mr. Andrew J. Sparberg 4) My collections of Manhattan Bus Maps. Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1930 – The Book of Last Runs Manhattan, New York Third Avenue Railway Company The Third Avenue Railway Company discontinues service on the 110th Street streetcar line. This route began as a horse car line in 1885. The horse cars ran between the Fort Lee Ferry and First Avenue. The route was converted to battery cars in 1910. Source: New York Division Bulletin /July 2002, article by Mr. Bernard Linder Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1947 – The Book of Last Runs Lancaster, Pennsylvania Conestoga Transportation Company This will be the last day of streetcar service in Lancaster, Pennsylvania. The Conestoga Transportation Company discontinues service on 7th Ward Line, Ephrata Interurban Line and the Rocky Springs Park Line. Rocky Springs was home to the Rocky Springs Amusement Park and the trolleys ran until the last day of their season. Due to the heavy summer traffic the Rocky Springs Line was double tracked and peak summer service required twenty cars. The Park remained in operation until 1966. Source: “Pennsylvania Trolleys in Color”, Volume 1, (Morning Sun Books /1997) by Mr. William D. Volkmer Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1959 – The Book of First Runs New York City Transit Authority BMT Division IRT Lo-V motors begin service on the No. 7 Franklin Avenue Shuttle. Occasionally they are used in through service to Brighton Beach. They have had flanges added to the car bodies to bridge the gap at station platforms. Source: New York Division Bulletin /October 1966, article by Mr. Bernard Linder Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1960 – The Book of Last Runs Jersey City, New Jersey Erie Railroad New York, Susquehanna & Western Railroad The Erie Railroad closes the Pavonia Avenue Terminal in Jersey City. The only remaining services were the eight weekday trains of the Susquehanna Railroad. These were cut back to Susquehanna Transfer. Source: “Susquehanna Trackside 1954-1968” (Morning Sun Books / 2014) by Walter E. Zullig, Jr. Tuscarora Almanac – September 21, 1981 – The Book of Car Assignments New York City Transit Authority Division B A – 130 R-40 / 176 R-44 AA/B – 56 R-38 / 104 R-40 / 96 R-42 CC – 208 R-10 D – 40 R-32 / 100 R-38 / 180 R-40M/42 E – 30 R-32 / 8- R-44 / 168 R-46 F – 40 R-32 / 280 R-46 GG – 77 R-10 J – 80 R-16 / 32 R-27/30 / 32 R-46 LL 104 R-27/30 / 24 R-42 M/QB – 176 R-27/30 / 24 R-42 N – 272 R-32 RR – 128 R-27/30 / 104 R-32 / 64 R-42 JFK – 21 R-46 SS (FRANKLIN) – 12 R-27/30 Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 21 11:59:23 2018, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018. R-46s were assigned to the (J)? I thought curve clearance issues kept the 75' cars off the Three Stooges Division? I don't remember ever seeing R-44/46 cars there in those days, but I'm willing to be corrected. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 12:16:34 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 21 11:59:23 2018. R-46s were assigned to the (J)? JayZee: That is a typo. It should be R-42. I will correct the master. Thank you for catching that. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Fri Sep 21 12:57:27 2018, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018. Thanks as always!!! My observations:1) I did not know that any battery cars lasted in NYC into 1930. I thought they were all gone by WW1. I know there's been some discussion of using battery powered MUs or locos to replace diesels on some branch lines. I wonder if, with nearly 100 years of technological improvements, they'd be more efficient than they were back then? 2) It seems to me that the R40 Slants never, ever, in their 41 years of service, ran on a full-length D. While I know they ran on some soccer/baseball specials in the last 18 years (these had their southern end at 2nd Ave) and on the Yellow D in the 1980s, I have seen exactly Zero pics of a Slant signed up as a D between 205th and Coney Island. I've put this out there before, and even folks with operating experience have never recounted an instance of a Slant on a real D (not a special). So- if anyone knows, whether as a regular passenger, railfan, transit employee, or even just in possession of accurate records, of even one instance where a Slant ran on the D from 205th to Coney Island, please let me know. It doesn't matter to me whether it was via Brighton or West End- if the Slant ran on the D, as the D was then constituted, please give me as much info as you can- approximate date, what route did they borrow it from, whatever you can. Thank You all :) |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Fri Sep 21 13:20:19 2018, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018.   
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Sep 21 16:50:28 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by MainR3664 on Fri Sep 21 12:57:27 2018. The listing only shows R-40Ms on the D, no slants. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by northshore on Fri Sep 21 17:27:27 2018, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018. Bus route M-1 Madison & Chambers Streets was operated by Comprehensive Omnibus Corp.Bus route 12 Spring & Delancey Streets was operated by NYC Omnibus Corp. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 19:45:29 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 21 11:59:23 2018. Curly was a victim of soicumstance.:) |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 19:47:48 2018, in response to Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 11:11:10 2018. So by late 1981, 115 R-10s had already been scrapped. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by W.B. on Fri Sep 21 20:09:48 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by northshore on Fri Sep 21 17:27:27 2018. Between 1933 and 1935 (for M-1) / 1936 (for M-2 / 12), the operator for both was Green Bus Lines. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 21:05:25 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 19:47:48 2018. So by late 1981, 115 R-10s had already been scrapped Maybe not Steve. The list shows only those cars required for daily service. It does not include spares. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Fri Sep 21 21:58:25 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by randyo on Fri Sep 21 16:50:28 2018. I rode a R40 D train Once from 59th st to Brighton.The first cars did not have a D train signal..as did most of the rest were either blank or S SPECIAL sign. As far as I know...the train never went back out in service due to it being immediately layed up at near Ocean Pkway. As for me..I caught the next M to C.I. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 22:50:34 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by IRTRedbirdR33 on Fri Sep 21 21:05:25 2018. Given the state of the R-10s by then, they probably needed all the spares they could find. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by El-Train on Sat Sep 22 00:28:42 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 22:50:34 2018. The late, great SelkirkTMO once mentioned that the R-10's were operationally toast before the '70's graffiti/deferred maintenance one-two punch even hit it. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by SUBWAYMAN on Sat Sep 22 03:16:30 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by El-Train on Sat Sep 22 00:28:42 2018. It was likely all those miles they ran over the years. Of course at 20 years old, they would be due for an overhaul. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Sep 22 10:20:03 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by El-Train on Sat Sep 22 00:28:42 2018. Yeah, Kev didn't care for them much. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by William A. Padron on Sat Sep 22 13:07:02 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 22:50:34 2018. No, Steve, there were still at the time a considered amount of R-10's as spares to be used, in ratios, as the assignment lists were simply show the amount of cars were that were needed for each line at that time. The scrapping in bulk for the R-10's started to happen around the spring of 1983, when about 60 bad ordered cars were sidelined to the scrap line, including the first one was built and delivered #2950 (ex-1803).-William A. Padron ["a.c.f."] |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Sep 22 15:09:11 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Edwards! on Fri Sep 21 21:58:25 2018. Although R-40 slants were never officially assigned to certain lines, in the late 1960s/early 1970s anything that could run was use if needed and that includes mixed trains of 38s, 40s and 42s and even an occasional 27/30 and 32. I had a train one Sunday on the RR that had 2 R-27s, and R-16, 2 R-32s, another R-16 and 2 R-42s. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sat Sep 22 17:09:58 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Fri Sep 21 19:45:29 2018. Does that mean he was soicumsized? (_!_) |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by randyo on Sat Sep 22 18:37:07 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Avid Reader on Sat Sep 22 17:09:58 2018. Well, he was Jewish! |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Sat Sep 22 20:23:29 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by randyo on Sat Sep 22 18:37:07 2018. I wonder if he left a big tip? |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Sep 22 23:20:35 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Sep 22 20:23:29 2018. Why, soitenly!:) |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Sep 22 23:22:47 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by randyo on Sat Sep 22 15:09:11 2018. Your typical Borgaschmord train.:) |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Edwards! on Sun Sep 23 03:16:38 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by JayZeeBMT on Fri Sep 21 11:59:23 2018. Nah..R46s did visit the east...but NEVER IN SERVICE.No 75ft car ever did..and won't. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sun Sep 23 12:31:04 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by randyo on Sat Sep 22 18:37:07 2018. Well, he was Jewish! .Does that mean he is no longer Jewish? |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sun Sep 23 12:32:57 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Elkeeper on Sat Sep 22 20:23:29 2018. I wonder if he left a big tip? Well, he was Jewish! What do you think? |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Sun Sep 23 12:40:30 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Avid Reader on Sun Sep 23 12:32:57 2018. I wonder if he left a big tip?Well, he was Jewish! What do you think? I was a once in a life time thing. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sun Sep 23 13:03:08 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Avid Reader on Sun Sep 23 12:31:04 2018. Yeah, he's dead. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by MainR3664 on Sun Sep 23 13:47:54 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Edwards! on Fri Sep 21 21:58:25 2018. Thanks. So this seems to be it...Amazing- as there was no physical reason why Slants couldn't have been assigned to the D... |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 23 18:19:42 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Sat Sep 22 23:22:47 2018. And it ran horribly poorly. It was so slow it barely made it out of the 60 St tube into Qnsbro Plz. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Sep 23 18:24:26 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Edwards! on Sun Sep 23 03:16:38 2018. I wouldn’t say never in service, but definitely never in REGULAR service. They did visit once on a fantrip. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Mon Sep 24 04:42:48 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by MainR3664 on Fri Sep 21 12:57:27 2018. The R40s indeed appeared on the D in regular service. I personally saw them between 1983-84, but not many. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 24 05:29:53 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by randyo on Sun Sep 23 18:19:42 2018. Must have had more than its share of dead motors. Everybody out an push! |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon Sep 24 17:01:53 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 24 05:29:53 2018. My guess is that it was the R-16 that was dead! |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Steve B-8AVEXP on Mon Sep 24 18:18:08 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Elkeeper on Mon Sep 24 17:01:53 2018. Probably both of them! |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 25 13:14:47 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Mon Sep 24 04:42:48 2018. Yup, I operated a few. |
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Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21 |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Tue Sep 25 13:21:11 2018, in response to Re: Tuscarora Almanac for September 21, posted by Elkeeper on Mon Sep 24 17:01:53 2018. While I was still working, an R68/68A would be doing 18 MPH at best coming up the hill into Queensboro. |
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