|
|
| Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question (1470039) | |
 |
|
| Home > SubChat | |
[ Post a New Response | Return to the Index ]
[1 2] |
||
|
|
Page 1 of 2 |
|
|
| (1470039) | |
Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018 When the Q extension to 96/2 Avenue opened in Jan 2017, there was a series of posts showing the ridership at each station. It was rather lower than initial projections, as I recall.Now that we are a bit more than a year along, does anyone have more recent figures? It would be interesting to see if ridership has increased, decreased or leveled off. I don't ride the line regularly, but whenever I have boarded going downtown at 63/Lex or at Times Square, the cars seem to have a good number of riders. To my eye, it seems more crowded than the M, going to/from Queens Blvd. Thanks very much. |
|
|
| (1470041) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Mon Mar 19 19:53:28 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. My gut feel is that it's been level. The line gets good usage, but crush loading doesn't really seem to happen under normal circumstances. |
|
|
| (1470054) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by gbs on Mon Mar 19 22:40:48 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. Most important, has there been a noticeable and measurable improvement on the Lexington Av line? Less crowding, less dwell time, more reliability, better on-time performance? |
|
|
(Sponsored) |
iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
|
| (1470065) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Tue Mar 20 00:58:19 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. Realistically, I wouldn’t expect much truly heavy ridership on the SAS unless and until it is by some good fortune connected to some branch line in the Bronx as was originally intended. |
|
|
| (1470081) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by zac on Tue Mar 20 06:57:48 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. I don't have any numbers either, but the Q can be very crowded headed sb in the PM rush at Times Square. My guess has always been that they are coming from the hospital area along York. NY Presb, Sloan, HSS, etc... All of them used to get on at 68th/Lex. Of course there are people getting on at the other 2 stations but the few times I've been up there in PM rush 72nd is always the crowded one.My observation is the trains going NB are only packed when there are one of the frequent delays. If I lived up that way and had a choice I would choose the Q every time as it isn't nearly as crowded. The flip side is that it isn't nearly as frequent. |
|
|
| (1470099) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Tue Mar 20 08:10:37 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by zac on Tue Mar 20 06:57:48 2018. IDK the numbers but it should be interesting to see ridership levels today with the Lexington Avenue suspended. |
|
|
| (1470109) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Tue Mar 20 09:01:24 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Far Rockaway A Train on Tue Mar 20 08:10:37 2018. Southbound Q was very crowded. |
|
|
| (1470150) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by gp38/r42 chris on Tue Mar 20 19:20:47 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by randyo on Tue Mar 20 00:58:19 2018. Yeah it's sort of a dead end right now. A good busy dead end, but a dead end just the same. |
|
|
| (1470151) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue Mar 20 19:46:58 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. I don't have any stats, but from personal observation, during the PM Rush the CI bound trains seem to be more crowded than the 96th bound trains, which is the peak direction during the PM Rush. |
|
|
| (1470153) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by zac on Tue Mar 20 20:37:55 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Tue Mar 20 19:46:58 2018. It is hard to say which direction is peak with all the medical facilities clustered near 72nd St. |
|
|
| (1470166) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. Here are the latest numbers.Weekly turnstile counts are from Friday to the following Thursday. The average weekday entry+exit figures for the SAS 72, 86 and 96 stops were: 72,191 entries; 55,635 exits; 127,826 total for the week from 3/2/18 to 3/8/18. The corresponding figures for 3/3/2017-3/9/2017 were: 68,401 entries; 55,175 exits; 123,576 total. That's far short of the 200K daily users promised by Gov. Cuomo. The counts for the Lex for the same periods for the 68, 77, 86 and 96 stops were: 113,833; 89,624; 203,457 in 2018 and 127,223; 96,474; 223,697 in 2017 and 171,562; 121,542; 293,104 in 2016. Not much has changed in the last year regarding SAS use. |
|
|
| (1470167) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by MainR3664 on Wed Mar 21 06:53:29 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. My wife and I rode from 63/Lex to 86/2nd on Saturday March 10, about 17:20. Train had a good crowd up to 86th, and a decent number staying on to 96th. If they actually manage to build Phase 2, I'm sure both it, and Phase 1 will do well, or at least, adequately, |
|
|
| (1470168) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Q4 on Wed Mar 21 08:07:04 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018. Was the 200K usage projection for day 1 of service or what it was anticipated to grow to in the future? |
|
|
| (1470169) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 08:17:57 2018, in response to Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Mon Mar 19 19:37:07 2018. It is 190k |
|
|
| (1470170) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by SUBWAYMAN on Wed Mar 21 08:31:26 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Q4 on Wed Mar 21 08:07:04 2018. I think the usage projections were meant for anticipated growth. |
|
|
| (1470171) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 08:44:38 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Q4 on Wed Mar 21 08:07:04 2018. Was the 200K usage projection for day 1 of service or what it was anticipated to grow to in the future?You read it in the Daily News: On opening day, pent-up demand for Second Ave. subway service will flood the line’s four stations with more than 200,000 people, MTA officials say... |
|
|
| (1470172) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 08:48:16 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 08:17:57 2018. It is 190kOn what basis? 33% turnstile jumpers? |
|
|
| (1470174) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 09:45:59 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 08:48:16 2018. How did MTA and/or Cuomo come up with 200 K ?Did they cut bus service along 2nd Avenue ? |
|
|
| (1470175) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 09:51:52 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 09:45:59 2018. How did MTA and/or Cuomo come up with 200 K ?They needed an impressive number to justify the bloated construction cost? |
|
|
| (1470176) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 10:08:18 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 09:51:52 2018. Much of which caused by Taj Mahal station mezzanines.If ridership is so far below projections, why are they scheduling a scatter shot of N and R trains up there ? |
|
|
| (1470179) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by R30A on Wed Mar 21 10:30:08 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018. Exits are an irrelevant figure-Doubling the entrances is far more reliable than Entry+Exit. |
|
|
| (1470184) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by qveensboro_plaza on Wed Mar 21 11:57:13 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018. Thank you for these numbers.It looks as though the initial projections were rather off-base. The Lex counts, I assume, include people traveling uptown above 96 Street. This is probably not a very large number but still it would inflate the count somewhat in comparison to the 2Av numbers. 96/2Av has the largest entry/exit volume, due perhaps to bus transfers, and 96/Lex has the most dramatic drop in counts from 2016 to now. So I guess the new subway is a qualified success, taking some pressure off the Lex, but not yet (and perhaps never) fulfilling its role as a new East Side trunk line. |
|
|
| (1470185) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Wed Mar 21 11:58:24 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 10:08:18 2018. If ridership had been at projections, they probably would have needed to add more trains. It's not hard to play with the level of W service. |
|
|
| (1470186) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 12:08:09 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Wed Mar 21 11:57:13 2018. 96/2Av has the largest entry/exit volume, due perhaps to bus transfersYou are misinformed: Avg weekday entry/exit by station: 72 - 29,487/25996; 86 - 24,136/16,600; 96 - 18,567/13038 |
|
|
| (1470187) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 12:18:38 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by qveensboro_plaza on Wed Mar 21 11:57:13 2018. It is functioning as I anticipated - an east side version of the C train, albeit on a truncated route,. |
|
|
| (1470189) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Q4 on Wed Mar 21 12:42:22 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 08:44:38 2018. Thanks |
|
|
| (1470190) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 12:56:46 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018. Wait - in 2016, last period before SAS, Lex total was 293k. This year, it is 203k. Not much change? |
|
|
| (1470191) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 13:37:09 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 08:48:16 2018. On this basis.See page 7. |
|
|
| (1470192) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 14:10:11 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 13:37:09 2018. Thank you. I learn a new alternate fact from the MTA every day. |
|
|
| (1470193) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by randyo on Wed Mar 21 14:13:00 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Joe V on Wed Mar 21 10:08:18 2018. Many times, trains are routed off their normal routes to avoid congestion on those routes. |
|
|
| (1470194) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 14:14:15 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 14:10:11 2018. Why would you say that the number is false? |
|
|
| (1470196) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Mitch45 on Wed Mar 21 14:23:22 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by gp38/r42 chris on Tue Mar 20 19:20:47 2018. Almost a shuttle |
|
|
| (1470200) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 14:41:44 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 14:10:11 2018. Don't like the news? Shoot the messenger! |
|
|
| (1470201) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 14:43:39 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Mar 21 14:23:22 2018. A shuttle from 96th and 2nd to Coney Island? |
|
|
| (1470202) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 15:03:17 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 06:51:39 2018. You ignore people entering for the Q at 63rd St. These were included in MTA projections. |
|
|
| (1470222) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Andrew Saucci on Wed Mar 21 18:09:32 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by R30A on Wed Mar 21 10:30:08 2018. Double the entrance minus one for the man who never returned. |
|
|
| (1470243) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 22:20:59 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 15:03:17 2018. You ignore people entering for the Q at 63rd St. These were included in MTA projections.The Lex-63rd St station was open way before Jan 1, 2017. The MTA 200K projection was for the new stations that were to open on that date. |
|
|
| (1470244) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 22:25:15 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Union Tpke on Wed Mar 21 14:14:15 2018. Why would you say that the number is false?The MTA has a history of inflating numbers for their benefit. How many power outages were due to Con Ed? When my derived numbers from their feeds differs from their official party line, I've learned to trust my derivations. |
|
|
| (1470266) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by LA Scott on Thu Mar 22 08:31:52 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 15:03:17 2018. Looking at a weekly Metrocard data for 63-Lex:Week starting 3/3/18 : 114,973 Week starting 3/4/17 : 113,224 Week starting 3/5/16 : 89,499 Week starting 3/7/15 : 84,697 You can check out the weekly data going back to 2010 at my site |
|
|
| (1470281) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 12:02:59 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 22:20:59 2018. No. The MTA stats I've seen include 63rd because the Q brought in new passengers there. Also, there was a new entrance built at 3rd Ave. |
|
|
| (1470282) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 12:04:05 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Stephen Bauman on Wed Mar 21 22:25:15 2018. It sounds like your derivations have a bias. |
|
|
| (1470283) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 12:08:38 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by LA Scott on Thu Mar 22 08:31:52 2018. Thank you. Clearly, despite Mr. Bauman, the Q train led to a vast increase in use at 63rd St. |
|
|
| (1470288) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by SLRT on Thu Mar 22 12:49:59 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by Mitch45 on Wed Mar 21 14:23:22 2018. A Stubway. |
|
|
| (1470291) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by TUNNELRAT on Thu Mar 22 13:38:14 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by italianstallion on Wed Mar 21 14:43:39 2018. A very,very,long shuttle. |
|
|
| (1470292) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by William A. Padron on Thu Mar 22 14:12:36 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by TUNNELRAT on Thu Mar 22 13:38:14 2018. I always consider now that the 96th/2nd terminal station is the new 57th/7th or 57th/6th as a quasi northernmost "short-turnaround" point for trains heading back going southbound.-William A. Padron ["S2-1233"] |
|
|
| (1470295) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by SUBWAYMAN on Thu Mar 22 14:39:29 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 12:04:05 2018. Exactly! |
|
|
| (1470297) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Mar 22 14:54:20 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 12:02:59 2018. Maybe some MTA reports have included 63rd and some have not. What is undeniable is that the character of 63rd has massively changed as a result of the SAS. It's way more useful because you can go to many more locations from there now. There is also a lot of internal transfer traffic between the Q and the F that the MTA doesn't even report on (or possibly even measure). |
|
|
| (1470298) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by AlM on Thu Mar 22 14:55:59 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by William A. Padron on Thu Mar 22 14:12:36 2018. It's that too. But it's also a real line providing useful transport to a lot of people (though at a high construction cost). |
|
|
| (1470299) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Mar 22 14:58:14 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by AlM on Thu Mar 22 14:55:59 2018. as were the others. Of course, the next segment north shouldbe under construction NOW. And that to the south as well. |
|
|
| (1470300) | |
Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question |
|
|
Posted by italianstallion on Thu Mar 22 15:00:03 2018, in response to Re: Second Avenue Subway Ridership Question, posted by AlM on Thu Mar 22 14:54:20 2018. Of course. All ignored by Mr. Bauman. |
|
|
[1 2] |
||
|
|
Page 1 of 2 |
|
