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Phoenix |
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Posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Aug 27 17:26:38 2015 News |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 14:55:36 2015, in response to Phoenix, posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Aug 27 17:26:38 2015. This is great; hopefully the other cities get involved in the future.Now with more light rail lines in the future, I wonder how will they identify each line. Would they use colors, letters, numbers, or something else? If colors are used, I think the existing route should be known as the Red Line, because red is usually the first color that transit agencies use when they start color-coding rail lines. Since the existing light rail line serves Melrose (an up and coming gay area), Valley Metro better not call the existing route the Pink Line, otherwise it would be promoting stereotypes and could potentially be offensive to some gays. Pink is better saved for a line serving Ahwatukee, Chandler, Gilbert, and east Mesa via Chandler Boulevard, Williams Field Road, and Power Road, since much of that area is politically conservative thus likely has a lower than average gay population. If letters are used, I think the existing route should be the "M" line, but still be shown as red on maps. "M" would stand for four different things: Metrocenter, Melrose, Mesa, and Main. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Aug 28 17:31:15 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 14:55:36 2015. Logically speaking, it letters are used, the letter system should start with the letter “A” and continue in alphabetical order. That was behind the original logic of the IND lettering scheme although, with the addition of BMT lines to the letter system which also linked the main trunk lines with their northern branch lines. With the addition of BMT lines into the IND lettering system along with the subsequent abandonment of using double letters for paralleling local services, the original loggia of the letter system has been compromised. Most surface systems that use alpha numeric to identify lines have used numbers rather than letters and that makes sense since you can’t run out of numbers but you can eventually run out of letters which the NYCTS is coming close to doing. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 17:59:07 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by randyo on Fri Aug 28 17:31:15 2015. The problem with numbers is that some people may confuse them with bus lines, since here in the Phoenix area most bus routes use plain numbers. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Aug 28 18:05:16 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 17:59:07 2015. That would probably be a good reason to use letters instead, however, when the BMT decided to start numbering its streetcar routes in Bkln with the delivery of the PCCs, ti continued the number sequence established for its bus routes and eventually, the numbering system applied to all “surface” routes regardless of whether they were bus, trolley or late trolley coach. The same could be done in Phoenix. The light rail route numbers could start where the bus route numbers end the way it was done in Bkln. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 18:19:14 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by randyo on Fri Aug 28 18:05:16 2015. Here in Phoenix, bus routes are mostly numbered by their address on the Phoenix street grid based on the first two digits. The most notable exception is Route 8 (7th Avenue, which has West 7xx addresses), since Route 7 serves 7th Street (which has East 7xx addresses). Also, some cities (particularly in the East Valley) use their own addressing grids, but the bus routes serving those cities are still numbered by where the route fits in the Phoenix street grid. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Fri Aug 28 18:44:10 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by randyo on Fri Aug 28 17:31:15 2015. Randyo, that has always been a sore point with me. I never understood why the BMT trains had to shitcan numbers for letters when they were the ones that had the number system in the first place. I never saw numbers listed on the IRT Lines when I lived in New York. It would have been easier in my opinion to either let the IND trains join the IRT and keep their letters or give them numbers on the BMT since there were still enough digits to go around. That way someone would look at my #4 Sea Beach Fred and not wonder what the hell was that. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by FYBklyn1959 on Sun Aug 30 00:20:47 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 18:19:14 2015. I remember that from my October 1994 visit, thought it was pretty cool. Central Av is the dividing line in Phoenix between East and West, so naturally, the Central Ave line is the 0 (zero) :)(There was also a Blue Line on Central at least in the downtown area, as Phoenix had Red, Blue, Green and Yellow bus lines, the idea being that eventually those routes would become rail lines. Indeed, the current light rail follows much of that Red Line). |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Aug 30 14:32:10 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Pink Jazz on Fri Aug 28 18:19:14 2015. Not a bad idea, but then the light rail lines could follow the same pattern, unless of course they are on a completely private ROW and not an any specific street. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Aug 30 14:43:27 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Fri Aug 28 18:44:10 2015. Actually, after Mayor Hylan left office, and the city was no longer as hostile to the BMT, the IND lines were offered to the BMT to operate and the IND routes were supposed to continue the BMT numbering system. It was only after the BMT declined to operate the new (IND) subway lines at a 5 cent fare, that the city came up with the lettering system for its new subway. Under the BMT’s numbering system, and the numbering system assigned later to the IRT however, both locals and expresses on the same line carried the same number thus both the Brighton Lcl and Brighton Exp carried the number 1 and the West End Exp and West End Lcl carried the number 3. Had that exact system been applied to the BMT/IND after double letters for locals were eliminated, Then there would have been both an A local and an A express instead of the current A and misnamed C. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Easy on Sun Aug 30 17:33:02 2015, in response to Phoenix, posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Aug 27 17:26:38 2015. Phoenix. News. No comment. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:32:24 2015, in response to Phoenix, posted by TransitChuckG on Thu Aug 27 17:26:38 2015. Now why would he put it like that? |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:39:15 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by randyo on Sun Aug 30 14:43:27 2015. Actually, after Mayor Hylan left office, and the city was no longer as hostile to the BMTIf the city wasn't as hostile, why were they forcing a 5˘ fare on the BMT? |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:41:49 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by #4 Sea Beach Fred on Fri Aug 28 18:44:10 2015. I never understood why the BMT trains had to shitcan numbers for letters when they were the ones that had the number system in the first placeGovernment micromanagement. After June 1940, guess who was running things. |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Aug 31 03:48:02 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:32:24 2015. Probably because of folks like you ... or do you think Phoenix is a bastion of liberals? The guy is a real estate developer, they're the last people you would expect to be "liberals" given that the outcome of years of work is highly dependent on being very conservative and skilled in husbanding a project to conclusion.Strikes me as "in your face, we DID it!" I like this guy. :) |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Mon Aug 31 03:58:22 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:39:15 2015. Getting re-elected? That's why we keep hearing about "tax cuts" when they're already lower than they ever were and are destroying our ability to maintain our infrastructure and military. It's all about "I promise more money in your pocket by keeping the status quo" ... yay. :( |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by trains61 on Mon Aug 31 13:06:57 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by Olog-hai on Mon Aug 31 03:32:24 2015. Because that is exactly what it is Kool-Aid. I`ve said for years on this board and other places, "The LRT serves those moving from campus to campus." "It doesn`t go where folks reside." The Phoenix Mayor, confirmed just that in the linked article.We will see how the money distributed in the coming decades... |
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Re: Phoenix |
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Posted by Pink Jazz on Mon Aug 31 14:45:53 2015, in response to Re: Phoenix, posted by randyo on Sun Aug 30 14:32:10 2015. Since the existing line (and most of the lines on my dream system except for the Purple Line) are not confined to one street, this would not work. Colors or letters would work better.Also, if you wondered how the express routes were numbered, they are numbered based on the primary city or area that they serve: -51x - Scottsdale -52x - Tempe -53x - Mesa -54x - Chandler -56x - Southwest Valley (Avondale/Goodyear/Buckeye/Tolleson) -57x - Northwest Valley (Glendale/Peoria/Surprise) |
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