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| (1336428) | |
Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 12:47:12 2015 Are there enough express tracks indoors and indoor sections of yards to store the majority of the subway cars? |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Jan 28 13:10:19 2015, in response to Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 12:47:12 2015. Indoor storage is rather simple, and inexpensive, if not free.All you have to do is to build a cover over the existing yards. You sell the air space. So it would be Tracks, Parking, Major Retail, Commercial, and then thirty or so floors of residential. All fixed, ROAR |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 15:04:42 2015, in response to Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 12:47:12 2015. Sure are! Fulton Street tracks for the "A" are at least 5 miles long in Brooklyn, from Lafayette to Euclid. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 16:28:03 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Jan 28 13:10:19 2015. Great points! |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 16:30:46 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 15:04:42 2015. Thank You! But how about the rest of the system? Are there enough indoor tracks to store every subway car? |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 16:30:49 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 15:04:42 2015. Thank You! But how about the rest of the system? Are there enough indoor tracks to store every subway car? |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by sloth on Wed Jan 28 16:41:52 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Jan 28 13:10:19 2015. Sure. There's nothing unsafe about making yard moves with reduced visibility and added close clearances. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 16:30:46 2015. Well, assuming that all underground express tracks are available (in service).Calculate the miles of said trackage, then figure out the amount of cars to be stored & how much space they would need, factoring in car lengths & then you would have an answer. A mathematical challenge indeed, but Ill stick my neck out & guess B div yes, A div no. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by randyo on Wed Jan 28 17:14:45 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. Why not the A Div? You have all the exp tks of both the Bway and Lex Av lines, the Bway middle from 103 St to just south of the 125 St portal, The Pelham middle from N/O Hunts Pt to 138 St and both exp tks of the Bkln E/Pky Line. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Jan 28 17:17:26 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by sloth on Wed Jan 28 16:41:52 2015. How would vision and clearances change by putting a roof on the building.Maybe you loose a track or two, and have to reset some of them but that is not a given. ROAR |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 17:21:14 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by randyo on Wed Jan 28 17:14:45 2015. I Love Subchat :) |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by rbseabeach on Wed Jan 28 17:22:23 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. Thank You |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 17:45:24 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by randyo on Wed Jan 28 17:14:45 2015. Would all that trackage you mention hold all those cars in the Bronx yards??Lets not forget the Flushing line which has 400+ cars & no real underground storage other than the trackage to Javits (if available). Being an orphan line, most of # 7 equiptment would be outdoors. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Wed Jan 28 18:30:46 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 17:45:24 2015. For the 7 line they cut service to Grand Central and put layups between Times Square and GC. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by LA Scott on Wed Jan 28 18:49:33 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by sloth on Wed Jan 28 16:41:52 2015. Does reduced visibility and added close clearances cause problems at Jerome Avenue or Pitkin?Soon, two LIRR yards will be under cover. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Jace on Wed Jan 28 18:55:55 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. Figure about 80 miles of track needed for all equipment: 30 for the A division cars, 45 for the B division and another 5 for the C division (work cars). |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 19:23:09 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Wed Jan 28 18:30:46 2015. Let us not forget the center track of the IND Concourse. |
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| (1336577) | |
Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 00:11:15 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. One would also need to account for space taken up by interlockings. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by The Silence on Thu Jan 29 00:16:15 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Broadway Lion on Wed Jan 28 17:17:26 2015. You lose any natural lighting.the supports can cause blind spots. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 00:43:17 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. there was a time when NYCT would not store trains within the limits of a station. this was too allow police and and personnel to be able to see the platform on the other side.This had to be taken into consideration when calculating the number of trains you can fit between express stops. If there are 4 local stops, it means 4 less trains can fit in that lay up position. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 01:04:06 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 00:43:17 2015. If what I've seen on the IND Queens line is any indication, I'd say that rule doesn't apply anymore. |
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| (1336581) | |
Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 01:16:31 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Fisk Ave Jim on Wed Jan 28 16:57:28 2015. I'd actually say yes for the A division as well.There's 6 miles between 96th Street and Chambers Street on the west side, over 7 miles between 125th Street and Chambers Street on the east side, and about 3 miles between Atlantic Avenue and Utica Avenue in Brooklyn. That's about 32 miles of express tracks alone. Most of the cars of the 240th Street Yard could fit on the express tracks and yard near 137th Street, and between 121st Street and 101st Street. The rule of thumb for the A division is to estimate 100 cars per mile of track. So yes, there's enough room underground to store the 2,350 A Division cars, even after eliminating the Upper West Side's 5.2 miles from consideration. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 01:46:16 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 01:04:06 2015. 7 line does that on the structure. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Nilet on Thu Jan 29 05:45:31 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 01:16:31 2015. Which 5.2 miles on the upper west side and why might they not count? |
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| (1336617) | |
Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 08:37:14 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Nilet on Thu Jan 29 05:45:31 2015. The express tracks in some stations on the IRT mainline (96th, 72nd, 66th, and 59th in particular) due to the fact their protection from snow is comparable to a screen door on a submarine, or a chain link fence for a seawall. |
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| (1336664) | |
Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Jan 29 12:55:46 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 08:37:14 2015. 
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by jrf2 on Thu Jan 29 13:12:19 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 15:04:42 2015. Can't find mention of the 'L'. No third track underground if I recall. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Jan 29 13:23:19 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 00:43:17 2015. I don’t know when that procedure went into effect but if that were ever the case, it was probably during the graffiti epidemic to supposedly make it more difficult for the vandals to tag the trains. Otherwise, I recall trains load up both in subways and on el structures in station limits all the time. When I was the zone trainmaster for the Bkln IND, during cold weather plans, CC trains were laid up end to end on A4 tk between Shepherd Av and ENY with more also between ENY and Utica. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Jan 29 13:27:40 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by jrf2 on Thu Jan 29 13:12:19 2015. The L just keeps on running in the snow:
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| (1336682) | |
Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by r33/r36 mainline on Thu Jan 29 13:37:34 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by jrf2 on Thu Jan 29 13:12:19 2015. The L line cars are stored on CPW express tracks under these cold weather plans. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by randyo on Thu Jan 29 13:46:31 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by r33/r36 mainline on Thu Jan 29 13:37:34 2015. I hadn’t heard about that but when I was on the road, 14 St Line trains were stored on one of the tracks in the N 7 St tube between Bedford and 3 Av and through service single tracked on the other track. CPW seems a little far for trains from the L Line to be stored, but back in 1969, KK trains were stored on the 6 Av exp tks between 34/6 and W4 St so that would be a more logical place to store L trains. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Thu Jan 29 15:56:57 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by LA Scott on Wed Jan 28 18:49:33 2015. Witch too LIRR Yards? |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by FormerVanWyckBlvdUser on Thu Jan 29 18:19:54 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Elkeeper on Wed Jan 28 19:23:09 2015. And the long (rarely used) express tracks on the E/F Queens Blvd. line. Primarily 75th Ave to 169th St.And the (rarely used) express tracks from 7th Ave to Church Ave on the F/G line in Brooklyn. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 19:29:27 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by randyo on Thu Jan 29 13:23:19 2015. No. Something happened on one of the platforms on the 7 line.NYPD asked 7 line management and they agreed to allow opposing platforms to be visible instead of blocked out by layups. I seem to remember this being in practice system wide circa 2004. But the 7 line has always done this. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 23:34:48 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Jan 29 12:55:46 2015. Exactly! |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 23:37:12 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 23:34:48 2015. Though the new fare control there has reduced that problem somewhat. |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Fri Jan 30 08:46:48 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by R36 #9346 on Thu Jan 29 23:34:48 2015. :) |
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Re: Indoor Storage for trains? |
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Posted by randyo on Fri Jan 30 15:00:14 2015, in response to Re: Indoor Storage for trains?, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 29 19:29:27 2015. For the most part Flushing Line trains were not laid up on middle tracks since there was sufficient room in Corona Yd for the layups so I don’t really understand what the 7 Line management had to “agree” to. |
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