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| R-11 Fan Trip (1321407) | |
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R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 13:47:50 2014 I am working up a paper on the R-11's. A couple of weeks ago 8013 ran on a transit museum trip. Would someone have the exact date?Thanks in advance for any info. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Mysterious Friday 1986 on Wed Oct 29 13:56:13 2014, in response to R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 13:47:50 2014. Hey Larry,Car 8013 participated in the Nostalgia Run to the Rockaways on Sunday, August 3rd, 2014. Hope this helps. MF'86 |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 14:34:21 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Mysterious Friday 1986 on Wed Oct 29 13:56:13 2014. Car 8013 participated in the Nostalgia Run to the Rockaways on Sunday, August 3rd, 2014. Hope this helps.Yes it does. This was the first time this car has operated on over 30 years I believe. Thank you. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 14:34:21 2014. Larry, you should somehow indicate that 8013 came out of this in worse shape that it started in.Rain go in thru one of the open windows and .... I am not sure of the extent of the damage but it 8013 is back in the Museum but is dark and is closed off. It never should have been used in the Nostalgia train. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 16:28:23 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. Rain go in thru one of the open windows and .... I am not sure of the extent of the damage but it 8013 is back in the Museum but is dark and is closed off.I'm sorry to hear that. Larry, RedbirdR33 |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Stef on Wed Oct 29 16:55:23 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. The trip was done with good intentions.Look at it this way ---- if the car is back in the old display position (and I believe it is), that means it is buried. It may not be out again in the immediate future. The lighting issue is fixable, the Museum needs someone to commit to the repair work. Could it be done already? There's no way of knowing for sure what's happening with that car. -Stef |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Ray Jules on Wed Oct 29 16:57:07 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. "It never should have been used in the Nostalgia train."Not true. It is this type of talk that leads to bad things happening. The lights in the car are off because of a short in the roof. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 17:01:22 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Stef on Wed Oct 29 16:55:23 2014. I wouldn't be surprised if they pulled the shoes just to make sure nobody tries to light it back up until that's all repaired. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 17:03:45 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. I'd consider it a blessing myself, but then I'm an electrical engineer type person. It got outside, they obviously had no idea there was a problem until it actually DID get wet, the car did not go up in flames and become a total loss, electrical issues such as this can be repaired. That it happened without extensive damage is a GOOD thing. They can fix the leaks, replace the wiring that failed and then it'll be good to go next time. I don't see this as a big deal. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by milantram on Wed Oct 29 18:21:13 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 17:03:45 2014. IAWTP |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 18:38:57 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Stef on Wed Oct 29 16:55:23 2014. It is back in its old display postion.Stef - you know the old saying: "The road to hell is paved with good intentions". Obviously, they didn't pay that much attention to the whole car condition before they decided to use it. When a car is sitting in the Museum for 30 years you are supposed to go over it with a fine tooth comb before using it to find hidden issues. Apparently they didn't. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 18:41:08 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Ray Jules on Wed Oct 29 16:57:07 2014. Ray - I say it because a bad thing did happen.Those who supposed to "be in the know" apparently didn't do a proper due diligence on the over condition of the car before deciding to take it for a ride. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by chud1 on Wed Oct 29 18:43:04 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 18:38:57 2014. IAWTP!chud11. :).... |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 18:43:54 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 17:03:45 2014. "They can fix the leaks, replace the wiring that failed and then it'll be good to go next time"Knowing the way things happen with the MTA and their priorities it could be years before that happens. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 18:57:41 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 18:43:54 2014. I'm sure there are volunteers who love that car and will get to it when they have time. Museums are like that. Now consider the alternative ... wheels finally turned on that car after HOW long? It is no longer a "static display" ... enough went into it for it to be certified to run in the first place.If you own a house and have had a roof leak, they're not all that easy if you want the leak to stop. Whatever happened, water got in there and if water got in one crack, there's probably more. Find them, fix the leaks. Turning screws to get into the ceiling panels to change some wiring and transformers and sockets is no big deal. Fixing the roof is the big deal. I have a bit more faith in museum folks than you might. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 19:07:43 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 18:57:41 2014. Unka Kevin - all I can say is - we shall see what we shall see.I have a lot faith in the Museum folks too but you have to remember that the TM has to be self-sufficient meaning that they will have to wait their turn - revenue equipment has the priority not Museum equipment. There are still rattan seats waiting to be repaired/replaced in the BU's, the Lo-V and the D types. Those have been waiting for years. One of the gates on one of the BU's (I forget the car number) has been broken for almost a year. It too could be a rather simple fix but..... It is a big deal when you have to wait and wait and wait before it can be fixed. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:26:12 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 19:07:43 2014. Of course ... but thanks to Bill and several other dedicated people, the real issue is shop space. Getting up on the roof to seal it may require a shop trip, but the ceiling stuff can be done right where it is. A prudent engineer however will not bother starting work on that until the cause is resolved, no sense spending hard to get money to buy new wiring and parts only to have it get wet again.That car already had enough love to actually get it out on the road. That car has a sponsor at least. It's not going to the scrap heap over this. It's pure electrical work, that's fairly easy. Nobody knows how to do rattan anymore, and many car parts aren't there to be had anymore. Electricals are easy. So is roof work. I wouldn't worry about that. It's not like the carbody has redbird cancer or motors that would have to be built new. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:36:33 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:26:12 2014. I was told at the museum probably during the late 80's, that the rattan seats had been made for museum cars in Europe. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:37:27 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:36:33 2014. No surprise there. :(Here in America, we only train beancounters, not builders or fixers. That's why everything is made in China now. :( |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:41:56 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:37:27 2014. Yep. Well, when the time comes for restoration of the seats, hopefully they can find the same or other sources that can provide them.As a plus for this side of the pond, there were two Americans who repaired and restored the big BMT sign on the outside of the Coney Island terminal. Article in the Times a few yers back. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:45:47 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:41:56 2014. Saw that, and it looked nice. We really need to start teaching folks how to build and fix things over here, robots need meatbags or they stop botting. :) |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:46:17 2014, in response to R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 13:47:50 2014. They also ran on a fan trip in November 1967 - don't have the date, (again, all my stuff is packed away) but I was on it. Maybe you were too?Included run to Rockaway Park (not sure if also went to Mott. Ave./Inwood), a stop at Pitkin yard - we were allowed to walk around inside th shop, and a run into Court Street - still disused, & ten years before the Museum opened. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:48:28 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:45:47 2014. & robots can't play Beethoven (programmed maybe but not with humanity), nor can they play the Blues..... |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 20:04:09 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Express Rider on Wed Oct 29 19:48:28 2014. The more people become detached from reality in the virtual world, the sooner they won't be able to tell the difference. That worries me too. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 29 20:46:14 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:26:12 2014. Actually there are rattan restorers just as you can have a Persian carpet refringed. You just have to do some research. And yes the electrics are easy (but we know that). |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 20:58:21 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Wed Oct 29 20:46:14 2014. There are a handful of companies that will restore what you have, my understanding (FWIW) is that they need whole replacement seats made to fit the originals. Those can be VERY expensive.And yeah ... white wire, black wire, red wire, screwdriver, DAMN! Somebody didn't lock out the breaker. :) |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 29 21:29:37 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. It never should have been used in the Nostalgia train.I vehemently disagree! It was awesome and fair and just what they did, using the car on a fan trip. More power to them. They should live and be well and use other long dormant cars on fan trips. I'll buy tickets. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 29 21:33:33 2014, in response to R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Larry,RedbirdR33 on Wed Oct 29 13:47:50 2014. A couple of weeks ago 8013 ran on a transit museum trip. Would someone have the exact date?Google |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Train Dude on Thu Oct 30 00:14:58 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Allan on Wed Oct 29 15:32:20 2014. Unlike current subway car models, 8013 uses 600VDC for lighting rather than the 37.5VDC circuits on the more modern cars. If it got wet it's likely that wiring and possibly some unavailable relays like the polarity reverser were damaged I'm quite sure, though, that it can and will be repaired. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Oct 30 01:02:02 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 20:58:21 2014. pull the breaker or take out the hot if you can't trust the crew. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Oct 30 01:05:05 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Oct 30 01:02:02 2014. That was merely meant for fun there. I won't touch anything that I didn't PERSONALLY lock out. :)If I have to depend on somebody else to do it, then THEY can test it with their tongue. (grin) |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Oct 30 02:22:02 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Oct 30 01:05:05 2014. I have had a SMALL circle of trustworthy co-workers over the years. There have been others--a couple of whom I have threatened with retalliation in the event of repetition.td pointed out that 8013 is 600v wiring--that could mean more damage. Although it would not be "authentic, rewiring it to more modern/commonly available spares in places where it makes no difference to the look of the car... |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by RIPTA42HopeTunnel on Thu Oct 30 08:09:15 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Oct 29 19:26:12 2014. Nobody knows how to do rattan anymoreA quick Googling of "rattan repair new york city" brought up several existing businesses. $$$$, I'm sure, but the expertise is out there. |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Thu Oct 30 08:21:39 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by RIPTA42HopeTunnel on Thu Oct 30 08:09:15 2014. A quick GooglingO.M.G. OWNED!!!! |
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Re: R-11 Fan Trip |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Thu Oct 30 11:41:04 2014, in response to Re: R-11 Fan Trip, posted by Jackson Park B Train on Thu Oct 30 02:22:02 2014. Yep ... but all of the older cars with incandescent were also 600 DC for lighting, so this really isn't all that off the wall. Obviously there was flashover but cleaning that up ain't all that big a deal either. |
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