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| (1316198) | |
NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014 On Sunday, I took a day off to myself, and set about downtown Newark to do a little amateur photography. Of course, Newark Penn and the Light Rail were things I wanted to take pics of, so I made my way to the Pennsylvania Railroad's Art Deco station on Market Street. Of course, after just a few minutes of snapping away at NJT trains, Acelas and Keystones, an NJT worker approached me and said "they can see you taking pictures, you need permission for that." I dutifully asked where or from whom I might obtain such "permission", and was first directed to an NJT cop hanging out near the Dunkin' Donuts (where else), who directed me to the Amtrak Passenger services office, where the young lady at the desk, predictably, told me she couldn't give me permission to take pictures, even for my own personal use.Having no luck at Penn, I decided to get some pics of Newark Light Rail along Broad Street, being careful to take my pics from public sidewalks, not Light Rail stations. While I was standing opposite the Bears/Eagles stadium, in a public area, the trolley operator saw me, stopped his car, and admonished me that I "needed permission" to take pictures of his train. I asked him, "From the street? He insisted he knew what he was talking about. I tried telling everyone about NJT's stated policy, which is as follows (per nycsubway.org, and other sources, all of whom say JT ended the requirement for photography permission in 2005): New Jersey Transit: Quote from a letter from George Warrington, Executive Director of NJ Transit, dated 12/30/2005: Effective immediately, we will return to our historic practice, which enables hobbyists and other non-commercial photographers to take pictures in public areas throughout the NJ Transit system without obtaining permission or providing prior notice. There will also continue to be no restrictions on journalists in public areas of the system. Why are NJT people still insisting I need permission to photograph their trains, even from a public street? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:07:09 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. I applaud you on your demeanor. At least you were polite and didn't get in anyone's face hoping to provoke an arrest. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:10:21 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:07:09 2014. No need to give TMZ.com more material...LOL...I figured it was better to let it slide. I have a LOT more light on me these days, too, and I don't need any negative publicity.That said, I really do wish the powers that be at NJT would give their employees an in-service on this already... |
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iPhone 6 (4.7 Inch) Premium PU Leather Wallet Case - Red w/ Floral Interior - by Notch-It |
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| (1316201) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:11:44 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:10:21 2014. That is true too about spotlight. |
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| (1316204) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:20:17 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:11:44 2014. Fashion In The Fast Lane's James Arrested For Taking Pictures Of Trains In NewarkCarnegie Hall Emcee Says He Didn't Need Permission I don't know which would go over worse...the fact that I was taking pics of trains, or that I did it in Newark...LMAO! |
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| (1316205) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:21:01 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:20:17 2014. Hey, the only bad press is when you get no coverage at all |
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| (1316206) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by South Ferry on Tue Sep 30 21:29:08 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. While I haven't been able to test the theory, it is believed that the "Photography OK" was enacted while NJT was under reign of Warrington, and it is said in some circles the company-wide acceptance of the Policy expired when Warrington's term ended. Then again, I did wisely snatch up a NJT Film Permit when those were being offered under Warrington's regime. |
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| (1316207) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:34:25 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:21:01 2014. That's true. too! :) |
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| (1316210) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 30 21:55:58 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Dude on Tue Sep 30 21:07:09 2014. I don't think anyone actually does that. |
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| (1316212) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by NJCL2308 on Tue Sep 30 22:10:45 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. Fire off an email to customer service. Describe the employees involved and asking for clarification on their current policy. I shoot off an e-mail to them every year or so, so no one can say "Well, that policy is outdated." |
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| (1316216) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 30 23:20:45 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by NJCL2308 on Tue Sep 30 22:10:45 2014. Whatever goes on in Newark: it's Amtrak's railroad and rules. |
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| (1316219) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Wallyhorse on Wed Oct 1 00:40:54 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 30 23:20:45 2014. And of course there are the paranoid who think a terrorist might be watching these people taking pics closely or the people taking pics are being paid by terrorists to do so, not realizing its just people wanting to take pics. Even more so if such people lost someone on 9/11 or in another attack since. |
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| (1316222) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by WillD on Wed Oct 1 02:24:51 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 30 23:20:45 2014. The station itself is owned by NJ Transit, and I believe NJT maintains it. |
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| (1316223) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 02:34:30 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 30 23:20:45 2014. Amtrak allows photography without restriction.Of course, that didn't stop PATH, of all entities, from telling me they banned photography throughout on the authority of their nominal presence in the station. |
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| (1316228) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 1 05:28:44 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 02:34:30 2014. To my knowledge if you have an Amtrak ticket on your person, they allow you to take a pic. |
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| (1316229) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 06:21:58 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 1 05:28:44 2014. The only rule I know of is that Amtrak allows you to take pics without restriction from anyplace you're allowed to go— some station platforms are restricted to ticketed passengers, but Newark obviously isn't since they have to share the platforms with NJT and PATH. |
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| (1316238) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Wed Oct 1 08:50:41 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Wed Oct 1 05:28:44 2014. As Nilet noted, that is incorrect. You need an Amtrak ticket to access some platforms. But on any portion of Amtrak property that you are permitted to be on, you can take photos, or rather, amateur photography is not prohibited. Amateur photography is always permitted, everywhere in this country (with exceptions such as "expectation of privacy" and the like), by default, unless it is specifically prohibited. |
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| (1316239) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by terRAPIN station on Wed Oct 1 09:04:04 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. Having no luck at PennHuh? So because you couldn't find anyone to GIVE you permission, you rolled over and left? The cops didn't even tell you to stop/leave! LOL! You went all the way (well, not that far for you now, I guess) to Newark specifically to take rail photos and you let these incompetent fools walk all over you??? You don't value your time, it seems. the trolley operator saw me, stopped his car, and admonished me that I "needed permission" to take pictures of his train. I asked him, "From the street? He insisted he knew what he was talking about.Who cares what he thinks? Seriously! You know what the laws are (or in this case, aren't). You listened to him and stopped taking photos or no? Why are NJT people still insisting I need permission to photograph their trains, even from a public street?I have a lot of respect for train operators and other front-line transit employees, but some things have become obvious here over the years and I'm surprised you haven't picked up on it - these people are WRONG, a lot. It usually has to do with transit-related stuff that isn't in their job description. Thus, they are commenting on things that they don't know about and would have no reason to know about (and it's not just transit workers, as the same is true for anyone in any job). For example, a supposed photography policy. It's not the train operator's job to enforce a photography policy, even if it did exist (at worst they could tell/ask you to stop but they wouldn't do much more than that before just calling supervision or the cops). These personnel are supposed to report suspicions persons and actions to their supervisors or police (at least i assume that's the case, as that's what NYCT personnel are supposed to do). Not very reassuring that these people are not following their Homeland Security/internal security training. Sorry to hear that you were HARASSED but you also need to stand up for yourself and your rights and the American way. G-d bless the USA! Goodnight. |
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| (1316241) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:11:27 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by terRAPIN station on Wed Oct 1 09:04:04 2014. When have you stood up for photography rights? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:12:24 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by terRAPIN station on Wed Oct 1 08:50:41 2014. Amateur photography is always permitted, everywhere in this country (with exceptions such as "expectation of privacy" and the like)Such as the sign I saw forbidding photography in a hospital where the patients clearly had an expectation of privacy. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 09:15:12 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:11:27 2014. When haven't I??? When have I made a post like JayZeeBMT just did, talking about rolling over and giving up when not even dealing with the police? |
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| (1316246) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by mcorivervsaf on Wed Oct 1 09:32:22 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Tue Sep 30 21:55:58 2014. What about this incident by Carlos Miller provoking an arrest by Miami security, last year? |
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| (1316247) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:33:08 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 09:15:12 2014. When have you actually stood up to the police and explained that photography was legal? Or to anyone? |
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| (1316248) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:34:08 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by mcorivervsaf on Wed Oct 1 09:32:22 2014. How did he "provoke" an arrest? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 10:44:30 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by terRAPIN station on Wed Oct 1 09:04:04 2014. I'm not in the habit of risking arrest, detention, and suffering the harsh conditions of being a prisoner. When dealing with the police, it is the COP who determines, at that moment, what rights you have, if any, and how severely you will be dealt with. Sure, you can fight it out in the courts later, but today's media is filled with reports of those who died in police custody, under very questionable circumstances.As for the NJT personnel, I wasn't about to challenge them to the point that they called the cops. Perhaps you'll share with us the outcome of your last public challenge to the poli e or transit workers? |
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| (1316273) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by caine515 on Wed Oct 1 13:02:51 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:34:25 2014. I know in Knoxville TN for the bus service there taking pictures is okay as long as it isn't the bus terminal or the garage. Im thinking this is security issues. The same might be stronger for NJ Transit. Im guessing they are worried about terrorists taking pictures at any spots..especially train lines. Maybe that's why the taking picture issued occurred. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by terRAPIN sTaTiOn on Wed Oct 1 13:13:14 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 09:33:08 2014. This is my policy:You should not "stand up" to the police. You should inform them of the relevant rules/regulations (or lack thereof), as you understand them. If they still insist that you must stop photographing, then you can do one of two things. If you have time to kill (possibly a lot of time) and/or you're interested in a payday (after going through a possibly lengthy and costly legal process), then you can peacefully, civilly, and non-violently submit to arrest or whatever hopefully non-violent punishment they want to impose on you. If, however, you have responsibilities and places to be and/or a current or potential future employment situation that could be harmed by having an arrest on your record (I've read that even if the arrest/charges/whatever is vacated by the judge, records of the arrest/charges/whatever can still incorrectly linger in various databases), then you should walk away after peacefully, civilly, and non-violently stating that you maintain the legality of your actions, and then later take various available measures to report, publicize, and submit complaints about the misinformed actions of the officers. |
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| (1316278) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by terRAPIN sTaTiOn on Wed Oct 1 13:21:18 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 10:44:30 2014. I'm not in the habit of risking arrest, detention, and suffering the harsh conditions of being a prisoner. When dealing with the police, it is the COP who determines, at that moment, what rights you have, if any, and how severely you will be dealt with.Huh? I specifically said: "The cops didn't even tell you to stop/leave!" In other words, my post is referring to how you rolled over to the demands of non-Police. That's what I'm asking about. As for the NJT personnel, I wasn't about to challenge them to the point that they called the cops.Exactly! That's what I'm talking about! Why weren't you "about to challenge them to the point that they called the cops"? What are you afraid of? You think the second the cops arrive they will slam you to the ground, beat you to a bloody pulp, and arrest you for prohibited photography??? No, they are going to assess the situation, talk to you, and then decide what to do. Hell, many times when transit personnel threaten to call the cops, either they don't, or the cops don't show up. But either way, you can always defuse the situation (i.e. avoid arrest) once the cops do show up. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by terRAPIN sTaTiOn on Wed Oct 1 13:37:26 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by caine515 on Wed Oct 1 13:02:51 2014. I know in Knoxville TN for the bus service there taking pictures is okay as long as it isn't the bus terminal or the garage.It's not "ok". Amateur photography is always permitted, everywhere in this country (with exceptions such as "expectation of privacy" and the like), by default, unless it is specifically prohibited, by law or lawful regulation. You can take photos anywhere you are legally allowed to be (i.e. where you are not trespassing), on public property. Im thinking this is security issues.Ya think? Except it's not a real security issue. It's a made up one. Security Theatre (Google it). The same might be stronger for NJ Transit.NOPE. Amateur photography is always permitted, everywhere in this country (with exceptions such as "expectation of privacy" and the like), by default, unless it is specifically prohibited, by law or lawful regulation. NJT has no law or lawful regulation prohibiting amateur photography. If they did, you'd sure as heck know about it or better be able to find it easily. Maybe that's why the taking picture issued occurred.NOPE. It happened because the NJT employees are either misinformed and exceeding their job descriptions and/or because the employees don't want people taking their photos at work and they like using this lame "security" excuse. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 14:55:20 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by terRAPIN sTaTiOn on Wed Oct 1 13:21:18 2014. You think the second the cops arrive they will slam you to the ground, beat you to a bloody pulp, and arrest you for prohibited photography???Given the abysmal track record of police beating (and sometimes killing) people for minor infractions these days, I'm not trying to find out if NJT cops are as out-of-control as those in other police agencies around the country. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Oct 1 15:03:19 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 14:55:20 2014. Good post. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Jersey Mike on Wed Oct 1 15:09:22 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. Did you get any video? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Wed Oct 1 15:44:49 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. Very odd, as I have shot photos right in front of NJT PD and I have never gotten anything more than a "Good day", "Good afternoon", etc., etc. I have shot more than a few times at Hoboken Terminal as well and I have never had any trouble at all, not from police, employees, no one. (For the record, I DO NOT carry my MNR ID on me....sorry no railroaded courtesies exercised!!) |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by r17-6599 on Wed Oct 1 17:27:01 2014, in response to NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Tue Sep 30 21:02:56 2014. See Kim Komando's response to the railroad photography issue.http://www.komando.com/happening-now/274846/railroads-try-to-shut-down-train-photographers |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by chud1 on Wed Oct 1 18:12:18 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Wed Oct 1 15:44:49 2014. u do do carry ur id while on da job, right?chud1. :).... |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 1 18:49:13 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Bill From Maspeth on Tue Sep 30 23:20:45 2014. The tracks themselves are Amtrak. Everything else in NJT. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 1 18:50:42 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 02:34:30 2014. I wouldn't do it on PATH's side of the fence, but other than that, NJT had no right at all to tell you to stop. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 1 18:52:50 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 10:44:30 2014. None of that can happen because they cannot site any statute you were violating, other than bully talk. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by South Ferry on Wed Oct 1 18:57:46 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by South Ferry on Tue Sep 30 21:29:08 2014. +1. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 20:59:47 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by JayZeeBMT on Wed Oct 1 14:55:20 2014. That's utterly ridiculous. The ratio of widely publicized beatings-to-death to overall police stops is practically infinitely small. Don't be ridiculous. Give me a serious answer. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 21:14:31 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Train Man Paul : Metro-North's Best Conductor FOR ALL 3 LINES!!! on Wed Oct 1 15:44:49 2014. No, it's not odd at all, since the NJT PD didn't say anything to him either. So as per your experience, it's completely expected. The employees, OTOH, are a different story and much more unpredictable. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 21:16:07 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 1 18:50:42 2014. NJT didn't tell Nilet to stop. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 21:22:38 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Joe V on Wed Oct 1 18:52:50 2014. Huh? That hasn't stopped the NYPD within the subway. |
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| (1316358) | |
Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 21:29:22 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by terRAPIN sTaTiOn on Wed Oct 1 13:13:14 2014. Yes, and when have you personally followed that policy? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 1 21:50:28 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 21:29:22 2014. All the time. Why/when wouldn't I? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 21:53:49 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Terrapin Station on Wed Oct 1 21:50:28 2014. Give specific examples. Date, time, place, what happened. Thread links if possible. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 22:01:36 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 21:53:49 2014. Why? |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 22:06:06 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 22:01:36 2014. Because you keep telling other people they should have stood up for photography rights, but I don't think you've ever done so yourself. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Oct 2 08:44:11 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by Nilet on Wed Oct 1 22:06:06 2014. Why would you think that? LOL. |
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Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Thu Oct 2 09:40:31 2014, in response to Re: NJT Personnel STILL Don't Know Photography Policy, posted by TerrApin StatiON on Wed Oct 1 20:59:47 2014. It goes up if you look a certain way. |
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