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| Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av (1224218) | |
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| (1224945) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 09:44:01 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Edwards! on Mon May 27 00:19:33 2013. I have posted on that several times.over 20 years ago I heard a similar story that the subway WAS also built south of atlantic for a few blocks from a long time resident who remembers it being built.I was up on the street looking around when approached by him who asked me what I was looking for.when I told him he then told me this story. |
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| (1224959) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 11:52:35 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 09:44:01 2013. Whenever I hear all these stories of subway construction in areas that presently have no subway, I can't help but think that the construction that went on there had nothing to do with the subway. We all do know that there's much more than subway tunnels under the streets, right? |
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| (1224960) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 11:55:28 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 26 21:49:21 2013. Why? Culver has enough capacity for a Second Avenue service, a 6th avenue service and a crosstown service. Run the SAS service as an express on Culver. |
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| (1224961) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 12:01:22 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Edwards! on Mon May 27 00:33:30 2013. I don't have historical timetables for the Fulton St subway, but during the AM peak, the A runs 18tph max. Did the line operate more trains than that back in the day?The merge of the A/C is not the cause of long waits for trains. |
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| (1224962) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 27 12:07:25 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 11:55:28 2013. No it doesn't. Church can only turn so many trains. |
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| (1224963) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 12:31:42 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 27 12:07:25 2013. Yes, but Church is not the only terminal on the line, and Church can turn more trains than it presently does, especially if all local trains terminate at Church. |
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| (1224965) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 27 12:35:25 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 12:31:42 2013. There's absolutely no point in running anything but the F below Church. |
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| (1224966) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Andrew Saucci on Mon May 27 12:36:31 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 11:52:35 2013. "Whenever I hear all these stories of subway construction in areas that presently have no subway, I can't help but think that the construction that went on there had nothing to do with the subway."I noticed some construction in the middle of Stewart Avenue in Garden City, with some sort of a wooden retaining wall surrounding a boxed cutout. I have been tempted to post a picture of that with the caption, "Work progresses on the Stewart Avenue subway line in Garden City." I bet at least a few people would fall for it. "I saw it on Internet-- it must be true!" |
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| (1224969) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 12:44:28 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 27 12:35:25 2013. Actually, there's a lot of reason to do so. Do you think the Kings Hwy short turns and Ave X put-ins are operated because the Culver demands extra service between Church and KH?F local to Church or 18th avenue, G local to Church, SAS service express to Church, local to Stillwell. Some service is short turned at 2nd avenue. |
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| (1224974) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:00:41 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by renee gil on Mon May 27 02:05:47 2013. The center trackway stops at the bulkhead and having been down there myself, I don't even think it goes as far as 30Ft. The visible part of it looks so ambiguous that it could be mistaken for a provision for a diamond Xover rather than a center track. |
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| (1224976) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:10:45 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 11:52:35 2013. That may be true, but there is documentation of some subway lines and/or portions thereof that were built and either filled in or used for other purposes. One is the subway under Lex Av in Manhattan from about 28 St to 38 St which was intended for used by the BMT when the IRT temporarily withdrew from the dual contracts and the BMT was to have been awarded the Lex Av subway N/O Grand Central. Another is the provision for additional tracks under the east side of 4 Av in Bkln. There was a possibility that the 4 Av subway in that area might need to be expanded to 4 tracks so the PSC requested Con Ed to build its circuit breaker chambers under the east side of 4 Av as sections of subway tunnel in the event they would need to be reclaimed and used for that purpose. I have no knowledge if those chambers were actually built or if they were if they are still there but their construction was definitely called for. |
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| (1224978) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:15:44 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by J Trainloco on Mon May 27 12:01:22 2013. I would suspect that when the E operated along Fulton St, there were even more trains operating through Cranberry than there are today. I remember being a V/R M/M in 19069 and there always being congestion along 8 Av between 42 and G Hoyt due to the merger with the E. I had an A run for 2 weeks that averaged 15 min late arr Lefferts every day due to following trains. One day I had a train with 5 dead motors and didn't lose any more time due to it than I lost on other days with an OK train. |
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| (1224980) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:19:22 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Sun May 26 21:21:25 2013. I was about to say the same thing. There are portions of the London Underground where the larger subsurface stock runs along side the smaller tube stock with the tube service on local tracks and subsurface service on the express tracks and vice versa. |
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| (1224981) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:22:59 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Renee Gil on Sat May 25 22:59:13 2013. No. If you read his response, he was specifically referring to 6 Av. |
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| (1225006) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 16:53:48 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:19:22 2013. Or, just run it under Gun Hill Road and have a free transfer at Seymour Ave. |
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| (1225007) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by NorthShore on Mon May 27 16:58:38 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:19:22 2013. This arrangement sound similar to the Market Street Subway in Philadelphia where there are subway trains running parallel to subway-surface trolley cars. |
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| (1225008) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Mon May 27 17:02:15 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by NorthShore on Mon May 27 16:58:38 2013. Good point. Also although it is only one station, Qnsbro Plz has BMT and IRT cars on opposite sides of the platforms. |
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| (1225013) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 17:39:40 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Sat May 25 18:27:37 2013. So, the "D" train extension was never built because the funds were diverted to buy the Bronx portion of the NYW&B? Correct? |
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| (1225022) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by NorthShore on Mon May 27 18:59:14 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 17:39:40 2013. You are correct. |
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| (1225031) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 19:26:57 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:10:45 2013. the chambers were built. I have spoken to several t.a.workers over the years who have been in the tunnels to do work.the 2 tracks heading towards 95st. are actually the local&express track.when the R crosses the bay ridge div.you can see the 2 track roadway that was provided for.notice that the safety niches are BRICKED up.not solid cemented. |
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| (1225033) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 19:29:51 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by NorthShore on Mon May 27 18:59:14 2013. hey!don`t answer for ME.he is correct. |
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| (1225038) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 20:39:42 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by renee gil on Mon May 27 02:19:11 2013. Wasn't South 4th Street, Brooklyn, set up for 6 tracks, originally? I read somewhere that the project had been scaled down to 4 tracks, before this Second System project was abandoned. If so, where did the third set of tracks come from/go to? |
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| (1225046) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 21:35:06 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 20:39:42 2013. it was planned for 8 tracks,scaled down to 6 trackways& partial stations extending apx.130 feet in length for each trackway& partial platform. |
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| (1225050) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 21:59:24 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 21:35:06 2013. I knew about the Worth and Houston St connections to South 4th Street. Where were the others from/to? |
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| (1225051) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 22:04:38 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 21:59:24 2013. on the 8 track layout,I have no idea.very little is written on it.on nysubways.com you can get more info on the 2nd. system. |
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| (1225052) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 22:05:28 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 22:04:38 2013. that's nycsubways.org. |
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| (1225055) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 23:01:26 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 22:05:28 2013. Yea, I looked, but no real explanation how 2 sets of tracks from Manhattan became 6 or 8. Also, some interesting stuff on |
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| (1225056) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 23:02:26 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 23:01:26 2013. secondavenuesagas |
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| (1225061) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 01:10:30 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Elkeeper on Mon May 27 21:59:24 2013. from the east..1] Myrtle Ave/Central avenue to the LIRR Rockaway Line..with a branch line to 120th ave/Foch Blvd St Albans,Queens. 2]Utica Avenue subway..across private property from Bushwick ave..to Stuyvesant Avenue..super station st Fulton st..then across private property to Utica..then along that street to Flatlands to join an extension of the Nostrand subway,terminating at Avenue U. 3]The side project of all this was the replacement of the Broadway Bklyn El as far as Jamaica ave Crescent st,where in ENY it would have been joined by a spur from the Fulton st local tracks. From the West. 1]6th ave express via Houston st to South 4th/Beaver st/Bushwick ave.. 2]8th ave local via Worth st/East Bway/Broadway BROOKLYN and the South 4th st..two track tunnel. 2]a add on..Second avenue local to a junction with the HOUSTON line at Houston/Essex st 4 track station..two river tunnels to South 4th st..Broadway to the Jamaica El. |
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| (1225062) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue May 28 01:25:19 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 01:10:30 2013. Wow ... THANKS, guy! For this and the previous (chronological order) ... had no idea of the specifics before ... bravo! :) |
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| (1225064) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 01:46:28 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue May 28 01:25:19 2013. hey..i do what i can for my peeps.. |
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| (1225065) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue May 28 01:52:32 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 01:46:28 2013. Here ya go, cuz ... the peeps are on me! :)
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| (1225066) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 01:52:57 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:00:41 2013. i've only saw a film made by NYPD removing homeless folks from the tunnels.this is also how I learned of the partially built tunnel made for Second avenue trains to get to the BMT Nassau st line. |
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Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 02:10:32 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:00:41 2013. you're it's probably more like 15-20 ft long. I haven't been to that area in years... |
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| (1225074) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Edwards! on Tue May 28 02:13:44 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by SelkirkTMO on Tue May 28 01:52:32 2013. my favorites..thanks. |
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Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 02:38:26 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by randyo on Mon May 27 14:22:59 2013. Did the construction north of 57Th Street allow for the possibility of a left turn, to the west.This left turn would allow for a possible merge with the tail tunnel north of 57Th Street and 7Th Ave heading to the unbuilt BMT Morningside Heights line or the 8Th Ave CPW line. does that sound like he's talking about 57/6? he was talking about 57/7. |
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| (1225078) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 02:43:17 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 02:38:26 2013. no forget it. you're right randyo. I've got confused there for a sec. my mistake. |
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Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Avid Reader on Tue May 28 09:01:20 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 02:38:26 2013. I was referring to 57Th St. and 6Th. Ave.Sorry if I wasn't clear. I did not mean to confuse. |
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| (1225099) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by renee gil on Tue May 28 09:43:55 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by Avid Reader on Tue May 28 09:01:20 2013. yeah, I know. it wasn't until I read your post the 2nd time that I know you were talking about 57/6 not 57/7. |
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| (1225137) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by randyo on Tue May 28 16:15:51 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by tunnelrat on Mon May 27 19:26:57 2013. I walked through there with the late trainmaster George Abere who was the first to tell me about the bricked in safety niches. Until 86 St station was retiled, those bricked in safety niches were quite visible from the station platform. Before the platforms were extended for 600 ft trains, a track space for an extra track could be seen at the south end of both Bay Ridge Av and 77 St stations. The N/B platform extensions at those stations were built into those spaces. What I could never understand is that although there was supposed to be a provision for two extra tracks, the track spaces I saw only seemed to be enough for only one more track. Also if you carefully look from those 2 S/B platforms across to the N/B side, you can see that the N/B platforms are built over the roadbed for the N/B tracks. |
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| (1225534) | |
Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Thu May 30 13:42:30 2013, in response to Re: tracks after 57th St/6 Av, posted by renee gil on Thu May 23 20:39:10 2013. *extension. :) |
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