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| Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station (1158569) | |
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| (1158569) | |
Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012 Today I noticed in spray paint (not graffiti) "8 R160 painted on the wall of the south bound local track.I heard about the (J) going out to 9th Ave (D Line) in rush hours in the next pick. I wonder if this has something to do with this if a (J) train is rerouted ? Bill Newkirk |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat May 26 19:27:51 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012. I guess the sign shop is closed for the holiday. :) |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Dj Hammers on Sat May 26 20:10:51 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012. The same thing is present at the Jay Street MetroTech (ex-Lawrence Street) station on the R line |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by The Silence on Sat May 26 20:53:05 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Dj Hammers on Sat May 26 20:10:51 2012. ...where 8 car R160s opereated for about 2 years... |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by R36 #9346 on Sat May 26 20:57:31 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Dj Hammers on Sat May 26 20:10:51 2012. ...and all the way up the Broadway subway to 57th Street.Not new. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Neil Feldman on Sat May 26 21:16:01 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by The Silence on Sat May 26 20:53:05 2012. Yep, with the Brown M! |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by randyo on Sat May 26 21:56:30 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012. I can't understand why there would be a need for a special marker for 8 R-160s or for that matter a separate C/R board since with the exception of the R-42s which probably will never see Southern Div service again in 8 car consists, everything for an 8 car train of 60 footers is the same whether it's an R-32, R-143 or R-160. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Alex L. on Sat May 26 22:29:05 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by randyo on Sat May 26 21:56:30 2012. Depending on where the 8 car and 10 car station stop markers, the Conductor's position on an 8 car and 10 car train do not always line up. Identifying the board as an 8 car theoretically prevents someone on a 10 car train from opening up. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat May 26 22:46:57 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Alex L. on Sat May 26 22:29:05 2012. Been there too long, bro ... "theoretically" ... heh. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by R32_3671 on Sat May 26 23:00:43 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012. trust me, go to 9th ave and you see the new crew or dispaher room at 9th ave, its bigger than before, so ........... that gives it away |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 04:14:09 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by R32_3671 on Sat May 26 23:00:43 2012. If the J-train is extended to 9th Avenue during the rush hours it would seem to mean"A) the return of the J-train back to southern Brooklyn after a decade or more of absence B) that there ARE enough riders (or riders not accommodated by other routes) for a return to Nassau Street service despite some contentions that "nobody goes there". C) an "interesting" question about J and Z service - will both lines or the will only "J" train be extended. It's all good. Mike |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Newkirk Images on Sun May 27 06:36:13 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by R32_3671 on Sat May 26 23:00:43 2012. trust me, go to 9th ave and you see the new crew or dispaher room at 9th ave, its bigger than before, so ........... that gives it awayYep, I'm aware of that. The new building replaced the old shack, so something was in the works. Could this be the return of Eastern Division service to 9th Ave. since the old (M) used to terminate there in the late 80's ? Bill Newkirk |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun May 27 07:46:20 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 04:14:09 2012. Where will the cars come from? As it is, R42's from ENY and R46's from Jamaica are being transfered to support R46 C service.Still waiting for the answer. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Dyre Dan on Sun May 27 09:05:33 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 04:14:09 2012. C) an "interesting" question about J and Z service - will both lines or the will only "J" train be extended.Do trains designated "Z" run in the reverse-peak direction? If I'm right in thinking that they don't, then clearly no "Z" trains will be carrying rush-hour loads to southern Brooklyn, since peak direction trains on Brooklyn's Broadway become reverse-peak in the south, and vice versa. But starting "Z" trains at Broad St. in the evening, and especially ending them there in the morning, could be difficult if "J" trains are running through, so I expect both will run through when any do. Could "Z" trains (or some "J"s in the morning) originate from Coney Island yard and go into service at 9th Ave., then return to CIY after one round trip, changing letters between "J" and "Z" at Jamaica? |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 11:10:27 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Dyre Dan on Sun May 27 09:05:33 2012. From a previous message: Do trains designated "Z" run in the reverse-peak direction?Yes, they do. In the current schedule - Z trains start to leave Eastern Parkway headed for Broad Street to arrive in time for the evening rush hour trips to Archer Avenue terminal. During the AM rush hours, Z trains leave Eastern Parkway headed toward the Archer Avenue terminal for the trip to Broad Street, and then upon their return to Eastern Parkway are taken out of service. It's an interesting rotation of trains on the J and Z lines. Mike |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 27 14:06:27 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by randyo on Sat May 26 21:56:30 2012. Some stations have a stopping point for all trains (Pacific St northbound is one) where the conductor's position in an 8-car R160 would be different. Ironically, an 8-car R42 could use the same boards here. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sun May 27 14:08:36 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012.  When does the next pick begin? |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Handbrake on Sun May 27 16:33:38 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sun May 27 06:36:13 2012. New crew room structures at the north end of the northbound platform are part of the general CPM station rehab project over at 9th Avenue. How RTO may use the space??? |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by randyo on Sun May 27 23:47:32 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by randyo on Sat May 26 21:56:30 2012. I'm not saying there shouldn't be a separate board for 8 car trains, but all 8 car trains where the C/R operating position is 4 X 4 can use the same board. Only R-42s where the C/R operates 3 south and 5 north need a separate board. By the way, as I have mentioned before on many posts, when I was on the road anything less than a maximum length train needed no board since on a short train the C/R was expected to be able to observe that the entire train was in the station. The only place that trains of 8 X 60 footers needed a board was in the BMT Eastern where 8 cars was the maximum length. C/Rs were expected to be able to see that an 8 car or shorter train on a 10 car platform was completely in the station. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by randyo on Sun May 27 23:51:23 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 11:10:27 2012. Although I haven't personally seen them, I would Imagine that Z trains consisting of R-160s would carry J signs in the off peak direction since they would be making all stops that way anyhow. The only trains that would need to carry Z signs in both directions would be R-42s. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon May 28 01:34:55 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by randyo on Sun May 27 23:51:23 2012. Z trains come out as Z trains in BOTH directions..on both car classes.How that may be after the service change..IF there is one..remains to be seen. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Michael549 on Mon May 28 13:24:03 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by randyo on Sun May 27 23:51:23 2012. Hi Randyo - at times I forget that the R-160's can become any kind of train route with just an electronic sign change at the flick of a switch. In the past I have seen R-42 type trains stored at the Eastern Parkway yard or coming into service there at the station.I would be interesting to see a train labeled one thing to suddenly change it's electronic signage to something else, while at a passenger station, etc. In the very distant past #2 or #5 trains in the Bronx would be sent down the "wrong route" the conductors would say to "disregard the signs" this is a #2 at 149th Street-Grand Concourse when headed to the westside, when just a few stops before it was a #5 train. Stuff happens. Yes, now a train "is" whatever it is assigned to be at any given moment. Mike |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 28 13:35:33 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun May 27 07:46:20 2012. We all know Train Dude has 40 or 50 R38's hidden under his mattress. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Handbrake on Mon May 28 13:37:49 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Edwards! on Mon May 28 01:34:55 2012. Generally, with a re-routed R160, the main route is still advertised, with an amendment to the recording that announces the line re-routed over (No route re-flagging while enroute). The train maintains it's original call letters, and interval number so that the train can be identified by Control.As for changing route designations (Re-flagging) at a terminal, as long as an incoming train at a terminal does not arrive latter than the departure of the segment (Or extra) that will carry the new designation, it could work if there were a crew ready to work the interval. However I have not seen this to be RTO's practice today. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Railman718 on Mon May 28 13:40:21 2012, in response to Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Newkirk Images on Sat May 26 19:18:29 2012. Today I noticed in spray paint (not graffiti) "8 R160 painted on the wall of the south bound local track.I didnt see that when my Re-routed Mikey went to 95th Street Two weeks ago... |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon May 28 15:50:29 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Michael549 on Sun May 27 04:14:09 2012. Only a few petulant, ignorant asshats said "nobody" wanted Nassau thru service. There was significantly greater demand for direct Midtown service that happened to coincide with the need to improve operational efficiency so the southern route lost out. As I said then and various other times, eventually the ridership numbers will again justify some kind of thru service. Not that many people seem to give what I say much attention or credence...The J last ran in scheduled service to the south in 2001 for about 6 weeks right after 9/11. Before that, it ran through to Brighton from 1967 until 1973. I suspect they will have no choice but to run the J/Z pattern into Brooklyn unless they do away with Skip-Stop on the Jamaica end. All it takes is one train laying down anywhere between Broad and 9th Av and Nassau service will be borked and ripple all the way to JC. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 28 16:53:22 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon May 28 15:50:29 2012. Said service was borked regularly on the M. The good thing about extending the J to 9th is that if the service gets screwed over, the Z train can run local and cover for it. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon May 28 17:45:58 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Mon May 28 16:53:22 2012. The M borked south of Broad typically did not screw up Jamaica skip-stop. The problem with sending J or Z but not both is that the travel time to/from the south is too long for a graceful recovery in the headways. Essentially, the runs already south of Broad would have to be cut out of the equation and whatever was still in the north redesignated at Broad to match whatever the next n/b run is supposed to have been. If the trouble cleared before the end of extended service, merge the south trains in to the next matching interval; otherwise return them as Js. (Probably not that many folks coming from the south heading for Jamaica Av that it would be a big hassle to have them change trains if necessary.) Keeping several gap trains outside Broad or on the old bridge leads would be a given no matter how it gets configured. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Eric B on Mon May 28 21:27:58 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon May 28 15:50:29 2012. The plan I had heard did call for the Z being eliminated, and replaced by a 4 min. headway on the J. All the extra unused 32's and 42's would probably have to be fixed and restored to service for that. |
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Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station |
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Posted by Dupont Circle Station on Mon May 28 22:11:18 2012, in response to Re: Seen at 59th St-4th Ave Station, posted by Eric B on Mon May 28 21:27:58 2012. 4 minute headway would be like a conga line. Sure to be fun at the S-turn. Definitely have to send some of those puppies on to the south.If they're doing that, it might be worth continuing extended service until 9:30-10AM and 7-7:30PM. Pity it's hard getting highly accurate counts and time distribution of who's specifically going to Nassau from the southern stations, as well as transferring on at Pacific and MetroTech. |
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