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Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011 So I think by now most posters here are on board with racial and ethnic differences (and perhaps individual and gender differences as well) in a variety of traits—including psychological ones, such as intelligence and personality. And for those who aren't, you better rush out and buy The 10,000 Year Explosion and The Global Bell Curve. But now that this is clear, I want to talk about differences within major races, in this case Europeans.Here is a map I drew graphing the differences in average IQ for the different European nations:  The color codes represent national IQs, rounded up. I split the UK, Spain, and Italy into their constituent regions to show the important regional diversity in those countries. I drew most of these values from not just Richard Lynn's and Tatu Vanhanen's works, but from various other sources to get a better picture of the national IQ's of some countries (especially those in Eastern Europe). Still, some of these are estimates. But the thing that becomes obvious is that—despite a few oddball outliers (e.g, Lithuania, Slovenia)—most of these follow the lines of the major ethnic groups in Europe. Overall, the Germanic groups (English, Germans, Dutch, Scandinavians, Austrians, Swiss) do the best, all with average IQs upwards of 100. Next are the North Slavs (Russians, Poles, Czechs, Slovaks, Belarusians, Ukrainians), who all have average IQs around 98. The Uralic groups (Finns, Hungarians, and Estonians)—originally from North Asia—also do well, as well as the Germans and Slavs, but they possess some Asian ancestry (something that is rather obvious when one looks at the Hungarian facial averages below). Poorer showing are the Mediterranean countries, as evidenced by the poor scores of Portugal, southern Spain, southern Italy (with Sicily averaging an IQ of 90) and Greece. The Balkan region, populated by South Slavs, also fares poorly, but population genetics has shown these people are intermixed between the relatively new coming Slavs and the original Mediterranean peoples. And finally, the Celts: the Irish, Scots and Welsh—also fare relatively poorly (except the Welsh), with Ireland averaging 92, and Scotland coming in at about 96. France, with it's very mixed history, of Celtic (the ancient Gauls), Mediterranean, and Germanic heritage comes in with an average IQ of 98. The decline in IQ in Spain and Italy can be explained by racial differences in the population; the northern parts of both countries contain a more Germanic stock, whereas the southern parts are more Mediterranean in origin (and possess darker skin, rounder eyes, darker hair, as LuchAAA likes to point out). That the various European groups are separable into these ethnic subtypes becomes visible when you look at these facial averages: Germanics: English, Dutch, German, Austrian, Swiss, Swedish             Celts: Irish, Welsh    North Slavs: Russian, Polish, Czech, Ukrainian         Uralic: Finn, Hungarian     South Slavs: Serbian   Mediterranean: Spanish, Italian, Greek       Genetic analyses also confirm these relationships. With the ongoing fiscal troubles in Europe, this has obvious implications. Here's a breakdown of the unemployment rates, as current as I could find them, in the various European countries, grouped by ethnic family. Nothing saying that these numbers are truly comparable from country to country, as there is perhaps a wide variation in how they are derived, but it's still interesting to see: Denmark: 7.1% Sweden: 7.4% Norway: 3.3% Germany: 6.1% Austria: 3.7% Luxembourg: 4.6% Netherlands: 4.3% England: 7.8% Lithuania: 15.6% Latvia: 16.2% Poland: 9.4% Czech Republic: 6.4% Slovakia: 8.4% Russia: 6.5% Ukraine: 9.5% Slovenia: 8.4% Croatia: 14.7% Finland: 7.9% Estonia: 12.8% Hungary: 9.7% Ireland: 14.5% Scotland: 8.1% Wales: 8.4% Belgium: 7.5% France: 9.9% Spain: 21.2% Italy: 8% Greece: 15% Portugal: 12.3% Note that the Germanic countries are doing fairly well, way ahead of the struggling Mediterranean countries. The Slavic countries are somewhere in between, despite the fact that all have fairly recently adopted market economies. In short, the productivity of Southern Europe lags behind that of the North, and as the IQ data demonstrates, this problem is to an extent intractable. This means that the European Union as it was envisioned can never be a truly common market with every member state on equal footing—or ever potentially so (I'm sure Olog will be happy about that). Rather the northern states will have to end up subsidizing the southern ones, and they must simply come to accept this. But hey, that's not so bad, because we have the exact same deal here in the States, where the wealthier northern states subsidize the poorer southern ones. Of course, the difference is, in Europe, the Mediterranean countries aren't screaming against higher taxes and calling for lower spending. Part of this exercise is also to understand the origin of these differences. In lieu of The 10,000 Year Explosion, many ethnic and racial differences evolved recently, since the advent of agriculture. Indeed, it was the Greeks, and later the Romans (via the Etruscans), who were the first Europeans to embrace civilization, yet it seems it was the Germans and the Slavs—who embraced civilization later—who came to dominate Europe, especially since the fall of Rome. (The Balkan peoples, who remained continuously in civilization under the Byzantine and later the Ottoman Empire seems to have fallen short today.) But why? One could argue, in the vein that Harpending and Cochran would, that the Germans and the Slavs initially were not well adapted to civilization because after they arrived Europe was plunged into a Dark Age from which it didn't fully emerge until the Renaissance nearly 1000 years later. Perhaps the Germans possessed certain traits that, once shaped by civilization's pacifying influence, allowed them to dominate European history. These are interesting questions for research, now that we know that genes are inextricably linked to historical events. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by SLRT on Thu Sep 8 06:06:13 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. Don't see ANY SubChatters there. They're all too, well, human looking. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 09:03:49 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SLRT on Thu Sep 8 06:06:13 2011. Well, no one ever claimed that SubChatters were "average"... ;P |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by SMAZ on Thu Sep 8 09:31:02 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. The USA's unemployment rate by the same measure is 16.2%. Only Spain has us beat.What does that say about us? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 11:38:06 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. I love the stereotypical division of Ireland on IQ... |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 17:40:51 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 11:38:06 2011. I would add this caveat about the score for Northern Ireland: I couldn't find too many sources, but the ones I found all suggest that the IQ's of the Protestant population is higher than those of the Catholic Irish. I went with the score I found here. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 17:55:02 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SMAZ on Thu Sep 8 09:31:02 2011. The USA's unemployment rate by the same measure is 16.2%.I drew most of my figures for the unemployment rates from the Google Public data Explorer, and apparently they got their statistics from Eurostat. I didn't look to see how the numbers were computed, but do you know how these were drawn and how they would compare to the U.S.? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 17:59:53 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 17:55:02 2011. here are some adjusted to US standards:http://www.bls.gov/ilc/intl_unemployment_rates_monthly.htm |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:24:59 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 17:55:02 2011. here's data from the OECD calculated using the same method for all countries. just change the subject from Harmonised Unemployment level to Harmonised Unemployment rate.http://stats.oecd.org/index.aspx?queryid=251 |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 18:27:04 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 17:59:53 2011. Thanks! The pattern still holds well, and the U.S. fares a lot better in the measure, doing about as well as France. The Germanic nations still fare much better than Ireland (and the U.S. for that matter) and the Mediterranean ones, according to this measure.One point where I'll agree with Olog, it is rather sad seeing Germany impose all these budgetary conditions on these fringe countries, when the problem is simply the lower productivity of their populaces. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 18:31:10 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:24:59 2011. Good find, thanks! I don't know how Mexico slipped in there with those low rates. Just who are the Mexicans counting? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 18:33:31 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 18:27:04 2011. But Wales does ok. Must be because it is a Protestant country. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:33:56 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 18:27:04 2011. If Greeks are genetically less intelligent than Germans why was Greeks civilization light years ahead of German civilization 3,000 years ago? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:35:18 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 18:31:10 2011. unemployed Mexicans move to the US? Mexico also has low wages. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 18:35:21 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:33:56 2011. Because IQ is bullshit, even though it is funny to laugh at the Fenians. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 18:37:59 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:35:18 2011. unemployed Mexicans move to the US? Mexico also has low wages.So do you think someone might move *OUT* of Mexico to find better pay? Or don't markets work like that? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by cortelyounext on Thu Sep 8 19:02:55 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. Who are you? You are analyzing intelligence quotient data across ethnicities while searching for macro-economic corrolaries? I'm just trying to understand whether it is in the best interest of Oklahoma State to run 6'1 190 lb Joseph Randle, the true sophomore burner out of Wichita Southeast, on "gap read" strike options or straight counters out of the "I" in order to overcome the Arizona Wildcats attacking 5-2 offset base defense. I'm not too bright. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 20:11:50 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 18:33:31 2011. Probably because they are more intermixed with the English than is Scotland or Ireland. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 20:16:24 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 18:33:56 2011. The Greeks of today are not on the same caliber of Greeks of ancient times, and even then it was only the Athenians that were the intellectual powerhouses of their day. It seems that the Ancient Athenians may have had an average IQ of 100 or more. Perhaps after the fall of their civilization their gene pool got diluted by the surrounding peoples. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 20:17:00 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 18:35:21 2011. It's actually far from it... |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Elkeeper on Thu Sep 8 20:18:54 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SLRT on Thu Sep 8 06:06:13 2011. Just look for the geeks with notebooks full of train serial #'s and foam coming from their mouths! |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 20:48:59 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 20:11:50 2011. But note how Wales does not have a state church, unlike England and Scotland. And a lot of people actually speak Welsh (unlike Scottish Gaelic, which is very very geographically restricted). It's also the part of Britain in which the response to playing the British national anthem is usually loud booing. If anything, Wales is the most independent-minded part of Britain.Of course, I'm a bit of a contradiction, as I belong to the former state church, speak Welsh, and would rather be run by the English than by our home-grown leftist loonies. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by dand124 on Thu Sep 8 21:32:40 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by cortelyounext on Thu Sep 8 19:02:55 2011. how are they against laterals? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Peter Rosa on Thu Sep 8 21:47:22 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. Moving outside of Europe for a moment, look at Lebanon. It's in the very lowest I.Q. group with an average score of 82. That's not a whole lot above what would get a person medically diagnosed as mentally retarded. Yet for generations the Lebanese have been known worldwide as very sharp merchants and businessmen, a so-called market dominant minority in countries on every continent. Hard to reconcile that status with near-retardation.My blog |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 21:53:42 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 20:48:59 2011. If anything, Wales is the most independent-minded part of Britain.Since they appear to be the most clever of the Celtic countries in the British Isles this not necessarily so surprising. So far what I've read seems to show that the Welsh are indeed genetically distinct from the English. Perhaps the Roman occupation (which didn't occur in upper Scotland and Ireland) allowed the populace there to evolve higher IQs, unlike the unconquered Scots and Irish. The Celts themselves seem to be related to the Basques of the Iberian peninsula, which makes sense since the Celtic peoples seem to be concentrated along the Atlantic coast. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 22:20:33 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Peter Rosa on Thu Sep 8 21:47:22 2011. An IQ of 70 signifies mental retardation for (probably Germanic) Whites only. For other races, that is quite normal. Indeed, the average IQ of sub-Saharan Africa is only 70, and this value would be above average for individuals from many groups, such as those in Africa's equatorial regions, among the Khoisan, and the Australian Aborigines, who have average IQ's in the 50s and 60s. On the low side, IQ means different thing for different peoples. I suspect that this is due to genes that are population-wide have given northern groups a general increase in intelligence, such that while an African with an IQ of 70 would be developmentally normal and quite competent socially, a White person with such an IQ would be developmentally handicapped.Many of these values that I based my map on, especially of the itty-bitty countries, are estimates, and even those that are based on studies are often based on small or possibly suspect samples. The value given for Lebanon is listed as a measurement, not an estimate, though. Also note that expatriates, especially those from very impoverished countries, are often unrepresentative of the population of their native lands. The average IQ of African immigrants to the States is 115, 3 standard deviations above the continent's mean. Impoverished countries often place huge barriers to travel such that often only the best and brightest can afford to escape. Indian immigrants are another excellent example; they seem to be intelligent people despite the fact that the average IQ of India is only 82. Indian Americans are not at all representative of their countrymen. I suspect that many Middle Eastern groups—especially those from Mesopotamian lands—were more intelligent in the past, but invasion from and intermixing with the previously nomadic Arabs and centuries of inbreeding may have depressed their intellects. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by AlM on Fri Sep 9 08:33:39 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Peter Rosa on Thu Sep 8 21:47:22 2011. And then there's Northern Ireland. Look at the wonders they've achieved with their relatively high IQ. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Fri Sep 9 08:41:28 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by AlM on Fri Sep 9 08:33:39 2011. That might be a misreading as well ;P. I think I will try to track down the PISA scores for the various UK countries to see what that says. How developed in Northern Ireland vs the rest of the island? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sun Sep 11 10:55:21 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 17:55:02 2011. I didn't look to see how the numbers were computed, but do you know how these were drawn and how they would compare to the U.S.?Europeans compute their number by including the underemployed and part-timers seeking full-time work. Our number by that measure is 16.2%. It's why we use two numbers for the unemployment rate. The oft-mentioned one (9.1%) and the European-like one in order for economists, policymakers and the markets to be able to compare apples with apples. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Mon Sep 12 00:48:59 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SMAZ on Sun Sep 11 10:55:21 2011. We're tied with Latvia then! ;P The U.S. also has a large population with sub-par IQ people. I'm sure that minorities disproportionally contribute to unemployment figures....I wonder what would happen if Obama proposed a $1 trillion+ stimulus geared at infrastructure construction/rebuilding, something we badly need anyway.... |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Sep 12 05:00:19 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Mon Sep 12 00:48:59 2011. The U.S. also has a large population with sub-par IQ people.We also had a large population with sub-par IQ during the Clinton Prosperity and an unemployment rate (by American calculations) of 3.9%. The sub-par IQ people didn't cause the economic collapse. The "smart" ones on Wall Street and in executive corporate suites did. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Mon Sep 12 08:06:06 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SMAZ on Mon Sep 12 05:00:19 2011. We also had a large population with sub-par IQ during the Clinton Prosperity and an unemployment rate (by American calculations) of 3.9%.The sub-par IQ people didn't cause the economic collapse. The "smart" ones on Wall Street and in executive corporate suites did. I'm not saying that Black and brown people caused the crash, as you're correct, they certainly did not, but in respect to the current economic situation, the Northern European countries—indeed most European countries—are doing better vs the U.S. The large minority population in the U.S. is part of the reason why. What was the European unemployment during the Clinton era? |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by orange blossom special on Mon Sep 12 17:50:08 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Mon Sep 12 00:48:59 2011. I thought he already did, and dedicated maybe 3% to what the bill was titled. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by SMAZ on Mon Sep 12 20:40:13 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Mon Sep 12 08:06:06 2011. What was the European unemployment during the Clinton era?Here is that of the US rate since 1994 under that method (known as the U6 rate) kindly provided by Fred.  Here is Germany's (the EU's flagship country) over roughly the same period. I imagine the spike of the early-mid 90's had to do with the integration of the former East Germany. France's since 1970 (thanks again Fred)  Sweden's  Italy's during our Clinton years broken down by geographical areas (Mezzogiorno is an expression for Southern and Insular Italy)  Italian article in "Investing Today" (try using Google Translate) about the misleading "official" number. "Truffetta" means "little fraud". |
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Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 15:40:31 2011, in response to Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by JayMan on Thu Sep 8 01:01:02 2011. Here's a tweaked corrected map, since the original map had too high values colored for the central Spanish provinces: I also wanted to look at three undiscussed major ethnic groups (major in the sense of being distinct families rather than being prominent of the global stage), the Balts (Lithuanians and Latvians) the Caucasians (the true Caucasians, of the Caucasus Mountains) and the Armenians (who despite living in the aforementioned region, form their own distinct group ethnically and linguistically): Baltic: Lithuanian/Latvian composite:  Only a female composite is available. While relatively unimportant politically or economically, from an anthropological point of view, the Baltic region seems to be important for one reason: this appears to be the source of blue eyes. The Balts are the most blue-eyed people in the world, and the trait spread from there to much of Europe and as far east as Afghanistan it seems. This may have taken place during the barbarian invasions of Rome, as Baltic groups may have hitched a ride with German tribes, possibly the Vandals. Evolutionarily they appear to be intermediate to Germanic and Slavic groups, as is obvious as seen here going from German, Lithuanian/Latvian, Russian:   The IQ for the Baltic region is somewhat problematic. No values are available for Latvia, only estimates, so I went with Lynn's & Vanhannen's estimates, of 97. L&V originally estimated Lithuania's IQ to be also 97, however in their second book, this was revised all the way down to 91. One paper I found reported a value of 90 based on a 1999 sample of 259 8- to 12-year olds, agreeing with L&V's numbers. Also, the unemployment data for the Baltic states (Lithuania: 15.6%, Latvia: 16.2%) does support the notion that these countries have slightly lower average IQ's than the countries that surround them. Why the Balts would stand out among the other European groups when much of their histories was shared with them is not clear. Newer measurements are needed (an online IQ test seems to yield values of 97 for the capital cities of both countries). Caucasian:  The Georgians appear to be the descended from the original inhabitants of the Caucasus. In appearance they seem to be similar to the Northern/Western European groups, and who knows, as the Caucasus is commonly considered to be the origin of Europeans (hence the term "Caucasian" and "Caucasoid"), perhaps this is because peoples from this area went on to populate the rest of Europe. I could find no IQ data for Georgia, so I stuck with L&V's estimate of 94. Other:  The Armenians appear to be their own people, an Indo-European group distinct from all other Indo-Europeans (like the Albanians), but who seem to have genetic and linguistic ties with the Greeks (as is obvious here). That Kim Kardashian is Armenian is obvious looking here.  The Armenians seem to have a reputation internationally similar to the Ashkenazi Jews, that is, as talented middle men. And indeed, it seems historically they have occupied that role. I could find no good IQ data for Armenia, only a reference (read the comments) that states that studies have shown that the IQ of Armenians in Armenia is 94, but of Armenians outside the country it is 107! A prolonged brain drain could have easily produced this result, however, Armenia is also known for a producing disproportionate share of chess champions. It is possible that the country's average IQ is fairly high. Again more study is needed. Cochran and Harpending argue that the Caucasus was the origin of the original Indo-Europeans, who managed to impose their language and culture across Europe and Asia as far east as Northern India. They propose they did this because they were the first true milk-drinkers—the first group to develop lactose tolerance. This gave them a competitive advantage that they used to impose their ways on the people they conquered. The Ossetians who live in the Caucasus are proposed to be their descendents. Unemployment data: Lithuania: 15.6% Latvia: 16.2% Georgia: 16.9% Armenia: 6.6%, (7.1%) Note that value for Armenia suggest that the population does indeed have a fairly high average IQ, perhaps higher than I'm reporting here. |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by SMAZ on Tue Sep 13 16:37:18 2011, in response to Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 15:40:31 2011. My uncle lives in Friuli (the only region in black).He graduated from university in the late 1940's-early 1950's (University of Bari) at a time when it was unthinkable for the son of a prole to even finish high school. Even middle class kids didn't go to university back then. He's from Puglia. A great example of stats skewed by brain drain. It's gotten worse since then because of so many people that now go to college and then leave the southern regions. They now leave entire countries altogether. |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 19:57:21 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by SMAZ on Tue Sep 13 16:37:18 2011. Interesting. Indeed, I strongly suspect that regions like Friuli have such high average IQ's because they have been a magnet for intelligent Italians from all over the country, including the South. In fact, when I was drawing my map, I capped out the IQ color at the navy for 102, but when I saw that one IQ result for Friuli came back as 103, and another at 104, I knew I needed to add a new color, hence the black.That said, I don't think that brain drain is the sole source of the southward decline in IQ in Italy, though it certainly has contributed. Racial differences (for Luch, this is noting that the major races, in this case Whites, can be subdivided further into Germanics, Celts, and so on) are also at play; the north is more Germanic is composition (actually being not far from Germany), whereas the south is more Mediterranean. As evidenced by Greece, Portugal, and southern Spain, Mediterranean peoples have lower average IQ's than other Europeans. But the decline in Italy is more dramatic than it is in say Spain, and owing to Italy's more linear geographic layout, I suspect that brain drain there was more pronounced. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Sep 13 20:03:32 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Sep 8 11:38:06 2011. To be expected, out of this particular source. |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:11:53 2011, in response to Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 15:40:31 2011. Addendums?!?!? |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by Olog-hai on Tue Sep 13 20:17:02 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:11:53 2011. He really meant "addendumbs". |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by Easy on Tue Sep 13 20:19:34 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:11:53 2011. An alternate according to Webster. |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:38:50 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by Easy on Tue Sep 13 20:19:34 2011. It still looks odd. |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:40:20 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Tue Sep 13 20:38:50 2011. Mainly because it's usually used in the plural. It's almost as bad as talking about an agendum. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 22:29:21 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by Olog-hai on Tue Sep 13 20:03:32 2011. Hey, I didn't make up the data, I'm just reporting... |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by MartinH on Wed Sep 14 15:00:40 2011, in response to Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by JayMan on Tue Sep 13 15:40:31 2011. Interesting post.Here's an interesting human biodiversity bibliography I found: http://www.humanbiologicaldiversity.com/ |
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Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe) |
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Posted by JayMan on Wed Sep 14 19:27:12 2011, in response to Re: Update: Corrected Map and Addendums (Human biodiversity in Europe), posted by MartinH on Wed Sep 14 15:00:40 2011. Bookmarked! Great find, thanks! I agree The 10,000 Year Explosion and Sailer's stuff are good intros to HBD. |
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Re: Human biodiversity in Europe |
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Posted by JayMan on Sat Sep 17 20:26:28 2011, in response to Re: Human biodiversity in Europe, posted by SMAZ on Mon Sep 12 20:40:13 2011. I meant to respond to this earlier, but those charts show that the unemployment rates in the northern European countries were never much worse than those in the U.S. (despite what the conservatives hawk about "socialist" countries like France). The persistent unemployment in southern Italy, coupled with the low unemployment in the north, highlights the IQ cline there.So much for the benefits of the "free" market though... The U.S. would be fine with a more socialist economy. |
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