Conservative's View of Social Security (750920) | |
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(750923) | |
Re: Conservative's View of Social Security |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 12 15:00:00 2011, in response to Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 14:50:12 2011. Well, I've only been paying into social security for 42 years, not 48.But I think both sides have a point. I deserve a reasonable payback for my money. But not at the expense of forcing young people to pay into the system outrageously, and not at the expense of going incredibly into debt to the Chinese. The actuaries who oversee the system say that the solutions don't have to be so horrendous. I'm willing to accept a moderate cut in what has been promised to me, for the good of the country. I don't think the system should be abolished. The best retirement system is a mix of a defined contribution plan and a defined benefit plan. That balances risk and reward properly between employee and employer. Lately employers are only providing the defined contribution portion, leaving social security as the only defined benefit plan most people have. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 15:13:27 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 12 15:00:00 2011. He never mentioned a cut in benefits. He was referring to a a cut in the rate we pay but raising the ceiling to include taxing earnings of those pesky millionaires who escape paying social security withholding on so much of their income. |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 16:44:20 2011, in response to Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 14:50:12 2011. LOL! So now you're a liberal! |
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(750996) | |
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Posted by AlM on Sat Mar 12 16:49:06 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 15:13:27 2011. Understood. But there needs to be a cut in benefits too. Just applying the 6.45% to all income instead of 108K isn't sufficient to make up the deficit. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:02:44 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 16:44:20 2011. No but I think we all see what you are. |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 17:04:36 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:02:44 2011. Oooh, snap. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:06:53 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 12 16:49:06 2011. Not being an actuary, or an accountant, I'd not know that but I think that removing the income limit and limit on taxable sources of contributions would do much to turn the tide. I also believe that restoring what was referred to as "The Lock Box" must be mandatory if we are going to begin to tap the previously untapped sources. |
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(751012) | |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 17:08:34 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:06:53 2011. Lock Box = Al Gore's proposal. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:15:21 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 17:08:34 2011. You just don't get it, do you? The lock Box was in place many years ago before it was eliminated. It should be restored. The difference between us is that I don't care who's idea it is, if it works. You being a partisan hack would oppose a cure for cancer if it came from a Republican. Grow a little. |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 17:17:30 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:15:21 2011. "You being a partisan hack would oppose a cure for cancer if it came from a Republican."Exactly how you and other righties react to Obama's ideas on a daily basis. |
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Posted by RockParkMan on Sat Mar 12 17:18:04 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:15:21 2011. The "Lock Box" was raided for the Nazi Bush's tax cuts. Retroactively repeal those tax cuts with interest for the unproductive Rich and restore the Lock Box. |
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(751030) | |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:23:50 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 17:17:30 2011. If I agreed with obamacare, I would have supported it regardless of partisan politics. I do not agree with obamacare because it's unworkable. I do not agree with obama's stance on GITMO and civilian trials for detainees - not because of partisan politics but because he's wrong - which, by the way he is now acknowledging by his actions.So by your comments, am I to conclude that you disagree with Jack's assessment of a fix for social security not because it's wrong but because the idea comes from the lips of a conservative? Sure seems that way to me. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:24:44 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by RockParkMan on Sat Mar 12 17:18:04 2011. It was not raided by BUSH, Willy, or is that Marty? |
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Posted by Fred G on Sat Mar 12 18:04:35 2011, in response to Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 14:50:12 2011. I like the idea, as long as we don't raid the funds as we have in past. That can be legislated tho, I'd think.your pal, Fred |
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Posted by SMAZ on Sat Mar 12 18:14:25 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by AlM on Sat Mar 12 16:49:06 2011. Just applying the 6.45% to all income instead of 108K isn't sufficient to make up the deficit.Actually it is. Not only that but it doesn't even have to be done all at once. You can also tack half (3.1%) of the individual rate on capital gains too and the whole individual rate (6.2%) on estate taxes and on otherwise tax-free muni bond gains. When the tax cuts for the rich are set to expire next year, I would make the current income tax rates permanent but tack on FICA at half the rate for currently exempt incomes (while dropping the 28% bracket to 25%). This is essentially a tax cut. I would establish the entire 6.2% employer rate starting at $400,000 and above but freezing it there so that the 0% donut hole between $108,000-400,000 would gradually close with time. Once this is no longer sufficient to keep the trust fund from borrowing from general revenues, that half-rate on the employee side would gradually increase on a pay-as-you-go basis. This would put SS on sound ground for eternity without further sinking the general revenue budget. At that point, that budget would have to be dealt with in order to close its long-term structural deficits. |
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Posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 19:04:02 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 17:23:50 2011. I don't disagree in general. I was commenting on the hypocrisy of the right. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 20:21:28 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by italianstallion on Sat Mar 12 19:04:02 2011. There is no hypocrisy on the right. What you are seeing are your own misconceptions of what conservatism is about. More the pity for you. |
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Posted by Train Dude on Sat Mar 12 20:23:48 2011, in response to Re: Conservative's View of Social Security, posted by Fred G on Sat Mar 12 18:04:35 2011. I think that was the idea |
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