The Lower 46

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The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010 edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d (Licensed CC-BY-SA-3.0, credit: John Doe.) Yes, it's another of those provocative re-drawing state boundaries maps. Discuss.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by PHXTUSbusfan* on Sat Aug 28 16:41:15 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d What is the point of this?
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Sat Aug 28 17:25:51 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Socio-politically, it's an interesting display. Inaccurate as all hell for upstate New York - we're more like New England, but then not quite as protestant. Once you get west of Syracuse though, it's all pretty much Minnesota out there until you hit Montana. Dunno what to make of the western half tho'. :)
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by WMATAGMOAGH* on Sat Aug 28 17:47:39 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by PHXTUSbusfan on Sat Aug 28 16:41:15 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Exactly my thoughts
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Dan Lawrence* on Sat Aug 28 18:44:08 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Columbia my foot. Leave my Maryland alone
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Sat Aug 28 19:16:12 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d We came really close to having a map like this 200 years ago:
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sat Aug 28 19:22:46 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Aug 28 19:16:12 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Evidently Jefferson didn't know where Michigan was.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sat Aug 28 19:32:07 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Dan Lawrence on Sat Aug 28 18:44:08 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Maryland's boundaries are completely ridiculous. What kind of shape for a state is that?!? ;)
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by JayMan* on Sat Aug 28 19:42:50 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d You may want to split Western Connecticut off from the rest of the state -- let them have the 203 area code (Fairfield and New Haven counties), which is more New York, as opposed to the rest of the state, which is more New England.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Sat Aug 28 19:58:36 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sat Aug 28 19:22:46 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I'd have a hard time saying that the state of Chersonesus makes the best cheese.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Orange Blossom Special* on Sat Aug 28 21:04:29 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sat Aug 28 19:22:46 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d what an idiot
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Orange Blossom Special* on Sat Aug 28 21:06:06 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d this map is totally politically incorrect. it should be nuevo mexico, not new!
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sat Aug 28 21:08:28 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Sat Aug 28 21:06:06 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d True. As if having a map with a defined border with Mexico wasn't racist enough!
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Dan Lawrence* on Sat Aug 28 21:42:58 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sat Aug 28 19:32:07 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Get in your Way-Bak Machine and go to the 17th Century and see if you can figure it out.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sat Aug 28 21:45:43 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Dan Lawrence on Sat Aug 28 21:42:58 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d You mean go back to when Maryland was relevant?
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Sat Aug 28 21:58:18 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Dan Lawrence on Sat Aug 28 21:42:58 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Huh? Why would anyone need to do that? It's well-documented!
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Scrabbleship* on Sun Aug 29 07:22:14 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by JayMan on Sat Aug 28 19:42:50 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I'd say put Berkshire County, MA inside with "New York" for continuity purposes. It's practically New York without political dysfunction and with Boston sports on cable instead.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SUBWAYsurf* on Sun Aug 29 09:57:09 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Sat Aug 28 21:04:29 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Thomas Jefferson, an idiot? Uh huh
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SUBWAYsurf* on Sun Aug 29 10:03:20 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Yeah! No New Jersey, fine by me!
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Sun Aug 29 12:39:33 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Carolinian unification sucks. South Carolina would totally drag down North Carolinia. Carolina is the reverse Korea (were unlike Korea, the south is the one that sucks).
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Sun Aug 29 14:18:03 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Scrabbleship on Sun Aug 29 07:22:14 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Actually ... we need to unplug Berkshire and airlift it out west to the Bay area where it belongs. Show Berserkely what REAL hippies are like. :)
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Sun Aug 29 14:24:51 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by SUBWAYsurf on Sun Aug 29 09:57:09 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Thomas Jefferson never existed ... so says the textbooks in Jesusland now.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SMAZ* on Sun Aug 29 15:38:21 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Aug 29 12:39:33 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I agree. NC and SC are two completely different States. One is in America, the other is in Dumbfuckistan.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by AEM-7AC #901* on Sun Aug 29 16:03:07 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Aug 28 17:25:51 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Inaccurate as all hell for upstate New York If I was breaking up New York, I'd probably keep the Hudson Valley and the Catskills in a half-assed means of maintaining the old Dutch boundaries of New Netherlands while keeping as much of the watershed as possible. One could pawn off the rest of Northern Upstate (read lands north of I-90) onto Vermont, but I'd feel guilty dumping a bunch of unusable land onto a state that can barely subsidize it... Dunno what to make of the western half tho' New Ontario. :-)
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by AEM-7AC #901* on Sun Aug 29 16:04:41 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Dan Lawrence on Sat Aug 28 18:44:08 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Leave my Maryland alone Maybe it's me, but it seems rather silly to have a metropolitan area divided up by three governments...
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Sun Aug 29 16:06:21 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Aug 29 16:03:07 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d As far as our part goes, "Je Me Souviens" (or "give me the damned souvenirs!" heh) ...
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Sun Aug 29 16:07:45 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Aug 29 16:04:41 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Why? NYC has four! And that seems to be working pretty well at emptying people's pockets ... :)
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Orange Blossom Special* on Sun Aug 29 17:05:14 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sun Aug 29 14:24:51 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d and if'n he did, he'd know where Michigan was!
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Orange Blossom Special* on Sun Aug 29 17:05:50 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Sun Aug 29 17:05:14 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Wait, those northern states aren't in our geography books
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 17:39:29 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by SUBWAYsurf on Sun Aug 29 09:57:09 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I don't believe in hell, but if there were one he'd be rotting in it. Hopefully for all eternity.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Sun Aug 29 17:51:08 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sun Aug 29 17:39:29 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d F.U. traitor.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Scrabbleship* on Sun Aug 29 17:55:08 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Aug 29 16:04:41 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d WMATA would be a lot less screwed up if it didn't have to deal with 3 states.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 18:11:13 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Aug 29 17:51:08 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Jefferson was a traitor to humanity that willingly participated in the genocide and enslavement of others.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Sun Aug 29 18:15:16 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sun Aug 29 18:11:13 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Jefferson's principles were those that liberated all of humanity, even if it took longer for some. Enslavement to kings and false prophets is still enslavement.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Grand Concourse* on Sun Aug 29 18:19:51 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Sat Aug 28 19:16:12 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d History channel had an interesting 2hr show about the states and how some have the shapes they have now. But they didn't really explain why Minnesota has that tip in Canada separated by water.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Spider-Pig* on Sun Aug 29 18:29:52 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Aug 29 18:19:51 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d The Treaty of Paris, concluded between the United States and Great Britain at the end of the American Revolutionary War, stated that the boundary between U.S. territory and the British possessions to the north would run "...through the Lake of the Woods to the northwestern most point thereof, and from thence on a due west course to the river Mississippi..." The parties did not suspect that the source of the Mississippi, Lake Itasca (then unknown to European explorers), was south of that point, and that thus the entire Mississippi was too far south to be intersected by a line running west from the Lake of the Woods. A factor in this mistake was the use of the Mitchell Map during the treaty negotiations; that map showed the Mississippi extending far to the north. In the Anglo-American Convention of 1818, the error was corrected by having the boundary run directly from the northwest point of the lake to the 49th parallel and then westward along it. When a survey team led by David Thompson finally located the northwesternmost point of the lake and surveyed this north-south line, it was found to intersect other bays of the lake and therefore cut off a portion of U.S. territory, now known as the Northwest Angle. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Angle#Origin
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by GP38/R42 Chris* on Sun Aug 29 18:34:25 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Aug 29 18:19:51 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d That was an interesting special. They repeat it every so often. It explains a lot of things, like that bump in Missouri, Oklahoma, and lots of the "strange" shapes of the states.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 18:52:21 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Aug 29 18:15:16 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Yes we certainly owe him a debt as a nation, but he obviously never intended to liberate humanity, nor has all of humanity been liberated to the best of my knowledge. Also for me personally his participation in genocide and enslaving his own children is something that I can't get past. I can understand being a product of your time, but he was doing things that were understood to be wrong in his moral culture (Judaism/Christianity) for thousands of years.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Grand Concourse* on Sun Aug 29 18:57:47 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Aug 29 18:29:52 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Thanks, but can't that section just join Canada? Seems kinda pointless to have to go thru Canada to get to the mainland imo.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40* on Sun Aug 29 19:00:00 2010, in response to The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sat Aug 28 16:37:49 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Utah should be called "Deseret" and incorporate all of the Mormon counties. Also - Long Island/NYC needs to be its own state. wayne
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Grand Concourse* on Sun Aug 29 19:00:05 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Sun Aug 29 18:34:25 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d They did a good job with a few things. I never knew about Franklin or why Michigan owns that segment north of Wisconson. The Minnesota point was bad as they mentioned it, but never came back to finish the reasoning. The 10-part States series did a better job, but it's been a while since I last saw it.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:20:33 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Grand Concourse on Sun Aug 29 18:57:47 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Point Roberts is a much more practically annoying functional exclave.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:22:51 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Easy on Sat Aug 28 19:22:46 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d At least he knew the Greek word for "peninsula".
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:26:34 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by PHXTUSbusfan on Sat Aug 28 16:41:15 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Because 38 wasn't a very good attempt at this version of fantasy. And equal populations have their nasties. And it's a fun hypothetical.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:29:45 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by SelkirkTMO on Sat Aug 28 17:25:51 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Socio-politically, it's an interesting display. Inaccurate as all hell for upstate New York - we're more like New England, but then not quite as protestant. Well, the point was that you're New York's wilderness rather than Bahston's wilderness. It's a very city-focussed map. Which is nice for St Louis, Kansas City, Memphis, Louisville, Cincinnati...
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:30:33 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by AEM-7AC #901 on Sun Aug 29 16:04:41 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Exactly. And I don't think Virginians would take kindly to being told they were Marylanders now.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 19:31:32 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sun Aug 29 19:26:34 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I think that you must have posted that equal population one before. I kind of remember seeing a map where Orange and LA counties appeared to be separate states despite their very unequal populations.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport* on Sun Aug 29 19:33:30 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Spider-Pig on Sun Aug 29 12:39:33 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Carolinian unification sucks. South Carolina would totally drag down North Carolinia Charlotteland crosses the state line though. Once you unify that, there isn't much South Carolina left. But at least palming off Savannahland on Georgia would get rid of some of the rest.
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 19:36:04 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Wayne-MrSlantR40 on Sun Aug 29 19:00:00 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Utah should be called "Deseret" and incorporate all of the Mormon counties. I kind of agree but that would be a pretty big state land wise, if not population wise. All of Utah, a good part of Wyoming, Nevada, and Idaho and bits of Arizona, Washington, Colorado(?), Montana(?) and New Mexico(?).
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Re: The Lower 46
Posted by Easy* on Sun Aug 29 19:41:52 2010, in response to Re: The Lower 46, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Sun Aug 29 19:29:45 2010.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Being city-focussed the only change that comes to mind would be to have Milwaukee and Chicago in the same state. Milwaukee is almost but not quite part of Chicagoland. About as much as northern Indiana.
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