WHY the GOP lost NY-23

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WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009 edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I wasn't aware of the game being played since I don't listen to teabaggers and Oxymorons. Turns out that the soap opera behind the "urban/suburban hip hop" didn't work very well and the VERY first rule of politics is to "know your district." Whoever did the research on NY-23 should be shot. Hoffman was way behind on the consrevative party line going into this race where Scozzafava is a popular republican NYS Assemblywoman representing a large part of NY-23 in the state Assembly's 122nd AD since 1998. She served four years as a Village of Gouverneur Trustee and was Mayor of the Village of Gouverneur from 1993 until her election to the Assembly. As a Member of the Assembly, Dede has been appointed to the leadership position of Whip for the Assembly Minority Conference. She serves on the Assembly Banks, Codes, Ethics and Guidance, Rules, and Ways and Means committees. The Assemblywoman has been a vocal advocate for Northern New York by holding forums and serving on a number of task forces to address the diverse needs of the community’s citizens. She has served as a member of the Manufacturing Task Force, the Hunting and Fishing Task Force, and has held hearings for the Task Force on Agriculture. In other words, she was a big wheel in the NYS republican party. When the congressional seat opened up, the republican chairmen of all of the counties in the district unanimously voted for her candidacy for the office. UNANIMOUSLY. And because of the strong republican votership in the district, it was hers to have. Democrats put up Owens, a respected "outsider" from Mineola (born in Brooklyn) to run against her. In other words, "a carpetbagger" since "outsiders" are not often tolerated in many places in rural upstate. Owens is a managing partner at Stafford, Owens, Piller, Murnane & Trombley, where he specializes in business law, international law, and estate and tax law. He is also an adjunct professor in business law at State University of New York at Plattsburgh and in 2004, he was appointed by then-Governor George Pataki to the College Council at that university.[3] He has made regular appearances as a business analyst on WCFE-TV, a PBS television station in Plattsburgh. In essence, Owens was your run of the mill "show candidate" for the democrats in a race nobody expected a democrat to get more than 25% of the vote (as always). Hoffman was put up by the conservative party and started work at age 14, pumping gas in his hometown of Saranac Lake, N.Y. He served for six years in the National Guard and Army Reserves, earned his way through college, became a CPA, and is now managing partner in a large accounting firm. Despite mistruths to the contrary, Hoffman is not and was not a resident of the 23rd district at any time although he insisted that he would move to the district if he got elected first. This is the same thing that Tedisco pulled in NY-20. Hoffman had previously sought the Republican nomination. In July, when Scozzafava was nominated instead, he offered to help her. His email to her read: "Hi Dede, Congratulations and the best of luck in your candidacy. Let me know if there is anything I can do to help. Doug." Shortly thereafter, however, he contacted Conservative Party leaders, seeking support for his own candidacy. Hoffman later stated, "I never promised that I would support Dede Scozzafava." One Republican leader said that Hoffman, while seeking the Republican nomination, had "repeatedly" pledged to support the nominee. Hoffman then hooked up with the national GOP, demanding that something be done with "this woman interfering with my election" and that brought in the "big guns" and lots of money. To make this short, the amount of money coming into Hoffman's campaign along with the intrigue from the national party quickly outspent the republican party's funds as well as the democrats. In early polling back in September, the race looked like this: Scozzafava: 35% Owens: 28% Hoffman: 16% Which would have been typical for the political makeup of the district. But with the influx of so much national money, Hoffman's numbers went up to: Hoffman 51% Owens 34% Scozzafava 13% Clearly, Hoffman would win this walking away. UNTIL ... Rush Limbaugh (didn't know about this until tonight since I don't listen to him) said on one of his shows that "Scozzafava was screwing every RINO in sight" and other derogatory things about a fine, upstanding, WELL KNOWN republican Assemblywoman well known and largely respected throughout her district. Sarah Palin alluded to the fact that Ms. Scozzafava was picked by party bosses and not by a primary electorate. "Best of all, Doug Hoffman has not been anointed by any political machine," she wrote her supporters. "Unfortunately, the Republican Party today has decided to choose a candidate that more than blurs the lines, and there is no real difference between the Democrat and the Republican in this race. This is why Doug Hoffman is running on the Conservative Party's ticket." The voters KNOW their 10 county "bosses" very well since they actually ELECT them. Then a parade of more and more "out of towners" descended into the district mouthing off various things that the locals KNEW to be completely untrue, and then came the loony teabaggers who annoyed the crap out of the locals. But that wasn't the final straw even though people were already getting tired of Hoffman's antics. Nope ... that special honor goes to Glen Beck, Fox News, the Today show and numerous other teevee types who had Hoffman on their shows. The voters, who had no real idea of what Hoffman was about or like got to see him right there in their livingrooms as dumber than dubya ... in ONE day, he dropped 20 points once he could be seen for what he is. A blithering idiot! So ... hint to the GOP ... upstate wants more of your "show us your loonies!" :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Charles G* on Wed Nov 4 02:48:33 2009, in response to WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I think what we saw yesterday was collectively a massive move to the center. Congressfolk on both sides of the aisle should take note.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 03:02:44 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Charles G on Wed Nov 4 02:48:33 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I dunno what to make of such a small sampling. I wasn't paying any attention to Virginia other than the democrats didn't really put anyone up and so the republicans got it. In New Jersey, the smell of the candidates outdid Bayonne on both sides and as usual, a third party "warning shot" failed like it always does. Daggett would have done much better numbers than he did if there was any real "message" from there. And NY-23 was willing to "stay the course" politically as well until they got to really DESPISE their "candidate" and broke with tradition. But as to any real message to be taken away from this year, it's "don't be incredibly stupid" ... I don't think that'll stick either, and I don't see the GOP waivering on their insistence on sticking to the far right wall. They've pretty much kicked out anyone to the left of Mussolini. :( I really don't think any lessons will have been learned unfortunately.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 03:08:14 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 03:02:44 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d so how do you explain Maine, a northeast lib state, voting against gay marriage? I love the way to blame the results in NY-23 on Rush, Palin, and Beck. Losing NJ is a big problem for Obama and the Dems/Libs. To lose such a blue state is amazing.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 03:10:34 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:08:14 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d If you can't keep up, I can't help you. Maine is a republican state. Look up who their senators are and other elected officials. And yes, the VOTERS in NY-23 are very specific about what pissed them off and quoted the various things said and done that lost the election for Hoffman. If you wish to ignore it, get some sleep and wake up in the morning and you'll discover that Hoffman (who had 51% in the polls) still lost ...
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 03:19:51 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 03:10:34 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d when did Hoffman have 51%? two months ago? Maine is pretty liberal bostonesque. Is there any state where voters would vote for gay marriage? I won't be listening to Rush to hear what he says about NY23. I'm going to the gym at 1p.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 03:22:26 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:19:51 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d See my Siena poll from Monday here ... Hoffman was STILL up 20 points just Monday! Here's what upstate voters saw ... you can go watch the whole GB interview itself with video keywords, "Glenn Beck Hoffman" if you wanna. Longest I've been able to stand Beck was about 20 seconds, this is shorter. :) Here's Hoffman ... heh.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 03:31:07 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 03:22:26 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d big fucking deal. palin and limbaugh and the GOP will probably throw Christ under the bus, in favor of Rubio, and when he wins, the "wingnuts" will look like geniuses. NY23 is a depressed area, and I'm not surprised at the results. I don't think Limbaugh and Palin had anything to do with it. Are you going to give Imus credit for the NJ results?
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 03:42:22 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:31:07 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Just for you, posted the whole thing. Why don't you watch it and get back to me. Stewart's take is remarkably identical to that of the area newspapers, area TV, and the voters themselves. I actually listened to WVAA, WEAV, and WVMT earlier today and EVERYBODY was saying exactly what I posted. Sorry you don't wanna hear it, but that's what happened. HOFFMAN WINS! Heh.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Charles G* on Wed Nov 4 04:35:54 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 03:02:44 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d My analysis comes from far away these days -- so it may be worth (even) less than usual... I see Virginia and New Jersey being situations where the moderates who put Obama over the top rejected the perceived "far left" they have seen to date and swung back the other way. NY-23 was set to go the same way until it played out like a Scooby-Doo episode. Scozzafava (sp?) probably would have won if it wasn't for those meddling kids... Once she withdrew, the moderates rejected the perceived "far right" outsiders who had come into their district. More for people to talk about on cable "news" networds, I guess. Can't say I miss not being able to hear MSNBC/CNN/Fox over-analyze everything using people with extreme views to do it...
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 04:56:07 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Charles G on Wed Nov 4 04:35:54 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Heh. We're of the same mind on the generals, the way I look at it is slightly different. As to NY-23, you're spot-on ... but in the end, even the republicans rejected the outsiders. The republican slant in that district is THAT severe. The area is almost entirely farmers along with a handful of dying "resort/roadtrip" seasonal business-types. Heavy on agriculture and tourism, and absolutely "upstate mentality." That being, "bring your OWN job 'cuz we don't HAVE any." If you're not an entrpreneur, they'll put you in a body bag once you float in the river in the spring after the ice melt. It's LIKE that up here, no joke. All of us, myself included, are all about what USED to be the core values of the republican party - personal responsibility, take care of your neighbors and they'll take care of you, nobody's gonna do it FOR you so get busy, and most important of all - government's job is to settle disputes (courts), provide for a common defense (military), build roads from this town to the next (we'll pay), educate our children (we'll cover that too) and leave us the FUCK alone. Don't try to peddle Jesus (we already know him), don't stick your nose in our business (personal as well as our living) and if we get stupid, cuff me, I'll walk to jail - I deserved it. And if we harm one another and can't settle the score peacefully, then put us in jail or just shoot us. Now we have these lunatics in the GOP who are as bad as the lunatics the dems had decades ago. Some of us worked at "Woodstock" and we've seen more than enough kooks (thank you, PeTA) and we'll shoot them too. :) As to Virginia, the dems didn't HAVE a candidate - there was a name on the ballot, but I'm not sure if it was just a tea stain. In New Jersey, you had a pair of Wall Street assholes who nobody can relate to except for perhaps Upper Montclair, Brielle or Deal (sorry folks, I lived in New Jersey for a short while in Monmouth county and Wayne) and a jamoke from out of nowhere. In Jersey, the guys who handled the cartage and hauling were KNOWN as crooks, and that's part of the politicosocial way things are. Being a crook is no big deal but the PROBLEM in New Jersey is that the Mafia used to get things DONE when they only took a 10% skim. It ain't LIKE that anymore and everybody in Jersey is PISSED. That's jettison the incumbent, can't be any plainer IF you know the territory and the "social contract." So each of these three items weren't actually a lesson of any kind other than a simple, curt "fuck you." :) But the talking necks now have 363 days worth of "here's what it means." Heh.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by GP38/R42 Chris* on Wed Nov 4 07:32:36 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:08:14 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Losing NJ is a big problem for Obama and the Dems/Libs. To lose such a blue state is amazing It is amazing, especially since he took time out of his presidency to come campaign in New Jersey about 4 or 5 times. While doing so probably didn't "hurt" Corzine, it's clear that it didn't help bim either, as he lost anyway. Obama's "everything he touches turns to gold" appeal is now over. Obama is still under the impression that he can stand next to some candidate and the votes will come flying in. You should hear one of his screaming campaign commercials for corzine that was played in Jersey, he still screams and chants like he's talking to a religious group.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by GP38/R42 Chris* on Wed Nov 4 07:34:47 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Charles G on Wed Nov 4 04:35:54 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d What a well written and rational post.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SMAZ* on Wed Nov 4 07:38:13 2009, in response to WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d The National Democrats weren't even contesting that district and it was considered a GOP hold until the Teabaggers committed seppuku and the Dems saw an opening.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SMAZ* on Wed Nov 4 07:46:57 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:31:07 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d If Rubio wins the GOP primary, the Dem wins the general election. The RNC drafted Christ for this very reason. He's a shoo-in in the general election.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by cortelyounext* on Wed Nov 4 08:34:14 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 03:10:34 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Maine is a republican state. Look up who their senators are and other elected officials. With respect, point of contention. Governor Baldacci is a Democrat. Olympia Snowe and Susan Collins are widely accepted to be among the most moderate and truly bi-partisan Republicans in the U.S. Senate. Beyond that, it was the duly elected Maine State Legislature that passed the law to legalize same sex marriage. Perhaps I misunderstood the point you were trying to make.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Parkchester (East 177th St)* on Wed Nov 4 11:51:09 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Wed Nov 4 07:32:36 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Apparently, either Bush Jr. didn't tell Obama during the transition, or Obama wasn't paying any attention, about Virgina. In 2005, Tim Kaine was able to overcome a deficit in the polls to beat Jerry Kilgore, despite this coming after Bush's victory in 2004, Bush's support for Kilgore in the run-up to the poll, and the presence of an 3rd party candidate. What happened in VA and NJ seems to be a case of lightning striking twice in the same place (or, in the case, two places.)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 12:19:23 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Charles G on Wed Nov 4 02:48:33 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I don't think there was a movement, I think we were always there. Last year's election gave the left the mistaken impression that they had broken out of their decades-long status as a minority interest.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 12:26:17 2009, in response to WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Good lord, you are wrong on just about every level. Owens won due to an amazingly incompetent Republican party leadership, which allowed 11 yahoos in a pizza joint to anoint a "Republican" whose positions were to the left of Stalin and then sinking nearly $1 million into said Republican's cause. That he nearly won with little backing outside Rush, Beck, Palin and the conservative blogosphere is a testament to their power, not an indictment. The GOP leaders now need to take heed and start advancing a more conservative agenda which last night was PROVEN to be a winning formula in large scale contests. Conservatives are quite happy right now. First off, they have been heard, and have proven to the GOP leaders that they cannot be ignored. Future NY-23 GOP candidates (it won't be Hoffman) will not be so damned liberal. Secondly, Owens is no radical leftist. He has campaigned against many aspects of Obamacare and is a prime candidate to stand with moderate Blue Dogs in Congress. That's actually better for the GOP than Scozzafava's public endorsements of Obamacare and Cap & Trade.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 12:44:37 2009, in response to WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d So are you listening to Rush's analysis of NY-23? Might as well, if you're going to accuse him of giving it to the Dems.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 12:45:21 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 4 07:46:57 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d LOL
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 13:23:15 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 12:44:37 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Rush saved it from the Republicans, who nominated a candidate to the left of the Democrat.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 14:55:13 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 12:26:17 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d The 11 Yahoos in a pizza joint were the GOP leaders of 11 upstate counties, who surely know their electorate far better than either the national Republicans or the Club for Growth, Dickhead Armey and their ilk. The latter deserve all the praise from Democrats for losing the most reliably GOP district in the northeast!
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 14:56:34 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 03:08:14 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Losing NJ? It was because Corzine was massively unpopular. The Dems retained control of the NJ legislature. Hardly a huge shift to the right.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 15:00:46 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Charles G on Wed Nov 4 04:35:54 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Everyone's overlooking that the turnout in VA and NJ was down from last year. The Dem base that turned out for Obama stayed home, because they were not energized by the candidates or the issues. Had minorities and young people voted in last year's numbers, the results would have been different.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 15:06:02 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 14:55:13 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d The 11 Yahoos in a pizza joint were the GOP leaders of 11 upstate counties, who surely know their electorate far better than either the national Republicans or the Club for Growth, Dickhead Armey and their ilk. Apparently not, since they nominated a de facto Democrat in what you claim elsewhere is a bastion of Republicanism. If you know anything about political machines, you would know that the will of the people rarely gets any attention in decisions such as this. Perhaps next year these yahoos will consider not flipping off the entire GOP base by nominating someone who they found so offensive. I can think of several DEMOCRATS who would have made a more palatable Republican candidate than Scozzafava.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 15:07:34 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 15:06:02 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d You forget that Dede Scozzafava was an Assembly-person duly elected by the largely GOP voters of her district.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 15:08:45 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 14:56:34 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Losing NJ? It was because Corzine was massively unpopular. Because he was a Democrat who identified with Obama, especially in recent days. Corzine was actually doing better until Corzine decided to shine a light on his relationship with the President.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 15:10:11 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 15:08:45 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Your last sentence is demonstrably false.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 15:17:49 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 15:07:34 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Actually, her assembly district is more liberal than NY-23 overall.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Chris R16/R2730* on Wed Nov 4 15:18:53 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 15:10:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Would you like to see how the polls began swinging towards Christie after Obama made his first visit to NJ last week?
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by italianstallion* on Wed Nov 4 16:00:23 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 15:18:53 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I know the polls. The were all over the lot. Each poll had a different outcome. There was no global trend.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:11:20 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by cortelyounext on Wed Nov 4 08:34:14 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Not a problem at all! Upstate New York also flipped once the loonies took over the natural GOP realm. I meant that more in a "traditional/always" sense ... that the republicans are in self-destruct mode, and have been ever since Clinton is yet another story for another time. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:12:48 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Parkchester (East 177th St) on Wed Nov 4 11:51:09 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Actually "opposite day" has been a tradition in BOTH states for quite some time now. Whoever is in at the national level is OUT at the local level. And so it is, again ... :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:16:27 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 16:00:23 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d And more importantly, all of the polls were WRONG. As surely as "instant news," the pollsters no longer are in the business of REFLECTING reality, they're in the business of CREATING reality. :(
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:17:52 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by italianstallion on Wed Nov 4 15:00:46 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Old Native American treatise ... "walking away IS a vote also." :(
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:19:18 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 4 07:38:13 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d One also has to remind the teabaggers that their boy was up by TWENTY POINTS ONE DAY BEFORE THE ELECTION! Gotta love them zanies. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:20:16 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 15:17:49 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Hahahahahahaha! :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:20:54 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 12:44:37 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I'll see if I can hulu Whoopie's take on it. I had no idea Rush lived in NY-23. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by Orange Blossom Special* on Wed Nov 4 17:24:43 2009, in response to WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 01:45:11 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I thought the GOP lost because the candidate quit and then endorsed the opponent. Makes me wonder why Hillary didn't endorse McCain and why Howard Dean didn't endorse Bush in '04
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by cortelyounext* on Wed Nov 4 17:25:30 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 17:16:27 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d *TRUTH*
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 17:28:50 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 17:20:54 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Hannity comes on at 6p down here. I might listen to the first two segments. I'm cooking some Tilapia and Couscous in the meantime.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:32:55 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Orange Blossom Special on Wed Nov 4 17:24:43 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Heh. GOP insists that they were supporting the third party Perot whacko instead of the GOP candidate. How does a party get volunteers for 2010 along the Canadian border when they've pissed everyone off? Ah right ... republican illegals to the rescue! And it'll work because they know what "border" means. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 17:59:16 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 17:28:50 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Good for you. Don't let your tie get grabbed by the spin cycle. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SMAZ* on Wed Nov 4 18:01:37 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Wed Nov 4 12:26:17 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d First off, they have been heard, and have proven to the GOP leaders that they cannot be ignored. They have also proven that they have no chance of winning in a GOP dominated district let alone other ones.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 18:02:22 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 17:59:16 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d LOL. That's O'Reilly. As for the fish, I read in Mens Health that Shrimp is bad for you. The farming methods are dangerous, and the shrimp are actually kept alive by chemicals and drugs. Farmed fish is bad.
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(519126)	view threaded
Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 18:17:04 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 18:02:22 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 18:17:53 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SMAZ on Wed Nov 4 18:01:37 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d Details ... details. :)
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by LuchAAA* on Wed Nov 4 18:30:53 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by SelkirkTMO on Wed Nov 4 18:17:04 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d That's Chik-Fil-A for those who don't know. Well chicken is loaded with chemical too.
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Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23
Posted by SelkirkTMO* on Wed Nov 4 19:00:19 2009, in response to Re: WHY the GOP lost NY-23, posted by LuchAAA on Wed Nov 4 18:30:53 2009.* edf40wrjww2msgDetailOT:detailStr fiogf49gjkf0d I didn't think you DID chikkin. Especially fried. :)
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