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| Re: Accident (403424) | |
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| (403496) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by cortelyounext on Thu Jan 15 17:12:50 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 16:40:54 2009. This is arguably the single greatest post ever made in the history of this site or any other transit related site for that matter. Strike that... this is the greatest post in the history of the Internet. It is concise, accurate, and breaks down heretofore paradigms. |
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| (403497) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:13:37 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 16:43:07 2009. No it is not. There is no "law of averages" when it comes to aircraft accidents. They happen when an event occurs which the pilot cannot counteract from the cockpit. Absolutely nothing says that the next airliner crash will be entirely fatal because accidents occur only by chance. Yes, people may die, but chances are greater you'll get in an accident on the way to the airport than crash on the airplane. Do you feel you're "due" for a car accident? |
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| (403498) | |
Re: GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued |
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Posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:14:54 2009, in response to Re: GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:07:55 2009. Yeah, but then we'd be hearing about crashes from chicken wire getting into the turbines. |
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| (403499) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:16:32 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by Terrapin Station on Thu Jan 15 16:17:12 2009. At least driving a car, you have 50% of the responsibility. |
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| (403500) | |
Re: GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:16:35 2009, in response to Re: GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued, posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:14:54 2009. Or debris gathering then catching fire. |
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| (403501) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:17:16 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:13:37 2009. Ok. |
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| (403503) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:18:57 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 15:54:52 2009. What are geese still doing there? Don't they fly south for the winter? |
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| (403504) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:20:37 2009, in response to Accident, posted by cortelyounext on Thu Jan 15 15:46:24 2009. Dayum, the plane has been carried downriver almost two miles! It's off the Village now. |
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| (403505) | |
Re: GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jan 15 17:21:16 2009, in response to GOOD NEWS: FAA reports all passengers/crew safely rescued, posted by WayneJay on Thu Jan 15 16:36:21 2009. That's why NY Waterway (for the most part) and Circle Line are awesome ferry companies. |
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| (403506) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:25:21 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 16:45:34 2009. And then it will be bought by Air Randomstan... |
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| (403507) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Thu Jan 15 17:25:57 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:20:37 2009. Well the current at this time is what, 4-5 knots? |
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| (403508) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:26:02 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:18:57 2009. These are Canadian geese, which are indigenous to NYC all year long. JFK actually has a fairly aggressive bird-control program, because JFK sits in the middle of a bird sanctuary. Piping plovers and least terns are endangered birds which nest around JFK, the NYCT (A) line, and the Rockaways. The PANYNJ has a nest-relocation program, and it also keeps the goose population down by egg-hatching control.La Guardia has to deal with common gulls, terns, and geese which nest around Flushing Meadow Park and the East River. A fully grown Canadian goose can weigh about 30 lbs., so sucking a flock of them into your engines would be enough to foul the turbines. |
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| (403509) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:26:53 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:25:21 2009. LOL! Nope, it will be scrapped. |
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| (403510) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:27:36 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by trainsarefun on Thu Jan 15 17:25:57 2009. Yup. 4 kts. That is a pretty strong current, too. |
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| (403512) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:30:02 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:26:53 2009. Are you kidding. They'll try to test that ASAP. Just like the plane in France that was tested, and failed, killing all aboard, and possibly some on ground.I'm not saying passenger service, but it will fly again. |
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| (403513) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:30:02 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:26:02 2009. There are now reports that the pilot reported bird strikes at 3,200 ft. That's cruise level for Canadian geese, so he probably slammed into quite a few of them... |
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| (403514) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:33:14 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:30:02 2009. Yup. Can't use the shotgun blasts they use on the ground to scare them off near runways. |
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| (403515) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:34:42 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:06:49 2009. But to say I'm irrational after today's crash, and Continental in Denver, makes you look so wrong.So two plane crashes in three months in which a total of 28 people were killed, all in the Continental crash. How many people were killed in car accidents during that same time? On average with 42,000 people killed per year in car accidents we can say that should be around 13,900 people killed in car accidents. With 135 million cars and assuming those cars make 1.5 trips per day, then we can safely say that it's about 4842 trips per vehicular death. According to the BTS there were 180,500 passengers between November and January last year, so with 28 deaths in US Airliners in that time we get 6,446 trips per passenger death in an accident. Yes, your fear is still irrational, and now we can prove it mathematically. |
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| (403516) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:34:55 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:30:02 2009. Trust me, that aircraft will never leave the ground again. The airline's insurers will write US Airways a check, and the airframe WILL be torched. Water damage alone will condemn the aircraft, never mind impact damage and structural cracks.US Airways will get a brand-new airplane to replace Davy Jones' latest acquisition. |
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| (403517) | |
Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:38:52 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:34:42 2009. No one died in the Continental crash, which shows that the only person who can be proven wrong is YOU! Trolling and flaming me again? |
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| (403518) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:39:40 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:34:55 2009. There must be a way to get AMTRAK to lower fares. They want $500 for a sleeper car room to Tampa. |
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| (403520) | |
Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident) |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:42:53 2009, in response to Accident, posted by cortelyounext on Thu Jan 15 15:46:24 2009. Since everyone made it out safely this is somewhat amusing IMHO:FlightAware.com #1549 record |
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| (403521) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 17:43:27 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:18:57 2009. No, there are geese everywhere this time of year too. They are always around. |
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| (403522) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:44:00 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:20:37 2009. So when will it pass under the VNB? |
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| (403523) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:44:42 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 17:43:27 2009. Still gonna fly? |
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| (403525) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:45:09 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:26:53 2009. I.e. the insurance will sell it to a scrappie, who will maximize his profits selling it whole to an airline from a country with dodgy safety standards. |
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| (403526) | |
Re: Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident) |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:48:37 2009, in response to Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident), posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:42:53 2009. Origin: KLGADestination: USS INTREPID SEA/AIR/SPACE MUSEUM |
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| (403527) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Jan 15 17:49:11 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 16:26:07 2009. Veteran pilots who are being interviewed on the various news reports can't heap any more praise on the pilot and crew for not having a single death in a situation which in the past has led to crashes which killed all on board. |
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| (403528) | |
Re: Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident) |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 17:49:23 2009, in response to Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident), posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:42:53 2009. Doesn't "arrival" imply at the expected destination? |
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| (403529) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:49:58 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:34:42 2009. Okay, it's not a very good argument against aviation, but aviation does suck. |
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| (403530) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:50:17 2009, in response to Accident, posted by cortelyounext on Thu Jan 15 15:46:24 2009. USAirways website is showing a "Status Exception" for this flight. Fucking creepy. |
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| (403531) | |
Re: Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident) |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:51:35 2009, in response to Re: Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident), posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 17:49:23 2009. Go to their website. They're reporting a "status exception" when you type in the flight number on flight status. |
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| (403534) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:52:57 2009, in response to Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:38:52 2009. Haha, looked up the wrong website and took data from a 1987 crash at Stapleton, oh well. That only amplifies what I am saying. Two major airlines have crashes and there are no fatalities. In the same time thousands of people die in car accidents. If it is your time to die it's your time to die, and you're not increasing your chances of living longer by avoiding the airlines. I'm not trolling you, you insist on providing a plethora of uninformed bullshit, and at least one poster has to provide some counter argument to the pages and pages of uninformed BS. If you fear death that much just go become a shut-in, don't go outside cause you might fall and break a hip. Your computer will give you cancer, better shut it down too. |
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| (403535) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:53:36 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:45:09 2009. I don't think the FAA will allow that. If the Feds really wanted to be mean, they could drag the aircraft off the pier in the Battery Park where it is now, and turn it over to the maritime Receiver Of Wrecks, because it is in the water, after all. That would keep it out of the hands of unscrupulous scrap dealers.In reality, however, the plane will be torched or cut up. Salvage metals are worth lots of $$$ these days. |
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| (403536) | |
Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River) |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 17:54:44 2009, in response to Re: US Airways Accident (crashed in Hudson River), posted by Easy on Thu Jan 15 17:18:57 2009. What are geese still doing there? Don't they fly south for the winter?For Canada geese, the NY metro area IS "south". They winter in all the wetlands around here. |
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| (403537) | |
Re: Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident) |
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Posted by Chris R16/R2730 on Thu Jan 15 17:56:04 2009, in response to Six Minutes (was:Re: Accident), posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:42:53 2009. Status: Diverted. LOL. |
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| (403538) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 17:56:32 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:53:36 2009. Salvage metals are worth lots of $$$ these days.Huge drop in prices in the last few months. |
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| (403540) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:57:25 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by Kew Gardens Teleport on Thu Jan 15 17:49:58 2009. Yes, I abhor the process of going through security, waiting hours through delays and holds, being crammed in a dehydrated tube while eating godawful food, and playing "where'd my bag go?" to cap it all off. However, I abhor the insane amount of bullshit spewed on the subject here by Mr Luch AAA so much more. There is no evidence that flying is any more dangerous than any other mode of transportation, in fact the evidence very much points the other way. I'd just much rather fly the plane myself from small, friendly airports and deal with the airlines for those times a GA plane can't fit the bill for whatever reason. |
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| (403541) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by trainsarefun on Thu Jan 15 17:59:22 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:57:25 2009. As long as you don't ride Metrolink - the RR with a fatality rate worse than most drivers - you'll be fine..... :) |
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| (403542) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:05:05 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:06:49 2009. Oh yeah, that sort of stuff "never" happens anywhere but NY. |
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| (403543) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:05:41 2009, in response to Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 17:38:52 2009. Will is correct. |
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| (403544) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:07:07 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by JayZeeBMT on Thu Jan 15 17:20:37 2009. They now have it tied to a pier in Battery Park City. |
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| (403545) | |
Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:07:53 2009, in response to Re: Accident, posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 17:57:25 2009. It's not insane bullshit. |
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| (403547) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:09:04 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:05:41 2009. How is he correct? No one died in the Continental crash in Denver. |
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| (403548) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:11:02 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:09:04 2009. I meant the premise that it's safer to fly than drive. I didn't pay attention to the actual numbers. |
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| (403549) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 18:12:09 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:09:04 2009. Because my brain fart resulted in my creating a statistic that was far more conservative than is actually the case. Thus while I was wrong in a simple fact, your outlook that air transportation is inherently dangerous is even more incorrect than it was at first glance. |
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| (403550) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:12:18 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:11:02 2009. No. They manipulate the numbers to favor flying. It's very dangerous, and I recommend that you cancel your trip to Cal. |
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| (403551) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 18:13:57 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by WillD on Thu Jan 15 18:12:09 2009. Thus while I was wrong in a simple fact, your outlook that air transportation is inherently dangerous is even more incorrect than it was at first glance.It's hopeless. Some people just don't deal with statistics. |
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| (403552) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by GP38/R42 Chris on Thu Jan 15 18:15:23 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by LuchAAA on Thu Jan 15 18:12:18 2009. OK. |
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| (403553) | |
Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident |
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Posted by petabread2 on Thu Jan 15 18:15:36 2009, in response to Re: Will D. = Aviation TROLL! Re: Accident, posted by AlM on Thu Jan 15 18:13:57 2009. From a pilot who has thousands of hours I can tell you LuchAAA, flying is still very safe. The pilots did a great job belly landing into the river. Just for the record, the NTSB will investigate so there should be no speculating as to what happend. The plane is still very much intact as well. |
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