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| SBS RULE (335076) | |
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| (335076) | |
SBS RULE |
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Posted by transitbuff on Thu Jul 11 12:29:45 2019 Can same-direction stop overs be made(within the one hour limit) without having to purchase a new ticket at each successive stop? |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Allan on Fri Jul 12 06:46:51 2019, in response to SBS RULE, posted by transitbuff on Thu Jul 11 12:29:45 2019. You aren't supposed to but I am sure lots of people do that anyway.All you can do is hope that if a member of the Eagle team inspects your receipt they don't know the number of the stop (printed on the ticket) that you originally got it from. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 10:01:26 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Allan on Fri Jul 12 06:46:51 2019. Or they don't know where you got on since it's an enroute inspection and you got on before the Eagle Team. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by davidy on Fri Jul 12 12:47:49 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 10:01:26 2019. The rule is one ride, but nobody will know unless they see where you come on. Do you think these inspectors really look closely at the receipts? I personally would think not. But I actually don't know. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 13:10:59 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by davidy on Fri Jul 12 12:47:49 2019. What if you need to transfer between the M34 and M34A or (more likely) Q52 and Q53?Also, the Q44 SBS is usually two routes: Willy B Plaza to Avenue U and Flushing Avenue to Knapp Street. A person traveling the whole route would have to transfer. In all cases, the same machines are used so it would be like dipping a MetroCard in the fare box on the same bus route, so no free transfer. |
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| (335086) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Pragmatist on Fri Jul 12 14:40:01 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 13:10:59 2019. I'm guessing it's a typo and that is B44, not Q (Main St SBS) The website seems to suggest that the transfer would be allowed, but is unclear on the scenario you present on the 44. They don't do a great job of explaining it. |
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| (335088) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 16:15:07 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Pragmatist on Fri Jul 12 14:40:01 2019. Yes, of course typo. |
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| (335089) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Pragmatist on Fri Jul 12 16:24:03 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 16:15:07 2019. One of my computers has a bad keyboard, but usually its me, not the machine! I was dropping off a document on Main St today, so it grabbed my eye right away.... |
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| (335090) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynTrain on Fri Jul 12 17:31:00 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Pragmatist on Fri Jul 12 16:24:03 2019. I've seen them (efficiently) come on at 8th & 23rd westbound. They wait at a busy stop like 8th/23rd on the sidewalk (around 10 of them) then quickly board and check everyone to see who got a ticket from the machine, and who didn't. You don't want to be that person without the ticket. Process is over in 30 seconds or less. |
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| (335094) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by nh153 on Sat Jul 13 04:21:58 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynTrain on Fri Jul 12 17:31:00 2019. I saw them once on the downtown M15-SBS at 2nd Ave and 106 St. About 6 or 7 people, mostly men, some women, got on the bus and quickly looked at everyone's ticket. On my bus, nobody was caught.But I don't think they take the time to figure out at which stop you got your ticket. I'm not even sure if they'd figure out whether you were using the same ticket for a return trip. I only think they look for route number, date and time, to make sure you didn't pull an old ticket out of your wallet. They are very fast, so they don't delay the bus for long. |
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| (335096) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Sat Jul 13 04:37:22 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by nh153 on Sat Jul 13 04:21:58 2019. The ink on those tickets seems to fade so fast I'm not sure how long someone could get away with using an old one even if the inspectors just skim them. The faded ink would give it away! |
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| (335097) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Jul 13 04:56:52 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by New Flyer #857 on Sat Jul 13 04:37:22 2019. What happens if you are on the bus for over an hour including waiting? Can they give you a ticket for it being expired although you are making a single trip? |
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| (335098) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Jul 13 07:49:47 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Jul 13 04:56:52 2019. I don’t think that there is an official expiration like on NJT. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sat Jul 13 16:21:20 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by davidy on Fri Jul 12 12:47:49 2019. Actually, the rule from the tariff is: "Regular fare passengers having $2.75 deducted from a valid value-based MetroCard at a Select Bus Service MetroCard Fare Collector, and then obtaining a valid proof-of-payment receipt from the MetroCard Fare Collector, are entitled to a one-way trip on the Select Bus Service route traveling in the direction indicated on the receipt."In other words, it is not one "ride," but rather one "trip." But what is a "trip"? It is not exactly clear since the term "trip" is not defined anywhere within the tariff. One reasonable definition of "trip" is that it constitutes the complete journey from origin to destination. After all, who would undertake a trip solely to an arbitrary transfer point? The "trip" is to where one is actually destined. Another definition of "trip" might the journey aboard a single vehicle. The answer does not relate to the rules on "transfers," since the hypothesized travel is entirely on a single route, and there is no "transfer" to a connecting route. In any case, the tariff really ought to define what is meant by the word "trip." |
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| (335100) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sat Jul 13 16:40:21 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Sat Jul 13 07:49:47 2019. There is an official expiration for proof-of-payment receipts. The tariff explains that "[a] proof-of-payment receipt is valid for up to one hour after the time indicated on the receipt . . . ." The tariff also states: "Passengers must retain the proof-of-payment receipt for the duration of the trip on Select Bus Service. Failure to present a valid proof-of-payment receipt when requested by a New York City Police Officer or authorized personnel may result in the imposition of a fine or civil penalty as set forth in the New York City Transit Rules of Conduct."Reading the rule strictly, the proof-of-payment expires one hour from the time indicated thereon. Assuming that the time indicated thereon is the actual time of issuance, then should the trip (including waiting time for the bus) take longer than one hour, the proof-of-payment receipt would expire enroute and no longer be valid. And by failing to have a valid proof-of-payment receipt, the passenger would be subject to the imposition of a fine or civil penalty. That said, the above provision appears to be conflict with another provision of the tariff, which states: "Regular fare passengers having $2.75 deducted from a valid value-based MetroCard at a Select Bus Service MetroCard Fare Collector, and then obtaining a valid proof-of-payment receipt from the MetroCard Fare Collector, are entitled to a one-way trip on the Select Bus Service route traveling in the direction indicated on the receipt. Passengers must retain the proof-of payment receipt for the duration of the Select Bus Service trip and present the receipt on request to a New York City Police Officer or authorized personnel." In other words, by having paid and obtaining a valid proof-of-payment receipt, there is an entitlement to a one-way trip. As a condition subsequent, the proof-of-payment receipt must be retained presented on request, but there is no obligation that the retained proof-of-payment receipt must remain valid for the duration of the trip (the only time it must be valid is at the time it is obtained). Moreover, with the entitlement of the one-way trip, the NYCTA is otherwise obligated to deliver the promised one-way trip, notwithstanding its tardiness in doing so. In the end, most citations appear to be returnable to the NCYTA's kangaroo administrative adjudication forum, where it is unlikely that NYCTA will find against itself. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Jul 14 04:51:43 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Sat Jul 13 16:40:21 2019. Thanks for the explanation. But meanwhile you would have to take time to fight the summons.Given what they did in Staten Island (giving a summons to someone who paid the fare) and the incident several years ago where someone was given a summons for legally riding around the City Hall loop where he was found guilty by TAB and it was upheld on appeal, I wouldn’t put anything past them, including ruling against themselves. https://www.silive.com/news/2019/07/mta-crackdown-express-bus-rider-claims-he-was-unjustly-accused-of-fare-evasion.html |
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| (335107) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Jul 14 08:18:58 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Jul 14 04:51:43 2019. In those cases the accused party ought to go to one of the TV stations (7 on Your Side, etc).If the case makes TV, the accused would might get the fine money refunded because of the bad publicity. |
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| (335110) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Sun Jul 14 12:23:42 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Jul 14 04:51:43 2019. My response did include the word "kangaroo," which largely incorporates the commentary you provide.A "tariff" is generally part of a contract between a public utility (e.g., electric service provider, telephone service provider, transportation service provider) and its customer, and outlines the rates and conditions for the services provided. The NYCTA tariff appears to be defective by its attempt to specify a criminal or civil penalty as if the tariff were a statute or regulation. Yet statutes must be duly-enacted by legislatures in a political environment and process, and regulations must be duly-adopted by administrative agencies pursuant to a statutorily-defined administrative procedure that is subject to a public hearing. In contrast, a tariff is an internally-produced document, typically filed with a public utilities commission, and sometimes subject to public review of the proposed rates. But it is not within the province of a public utility to write the law in a tariff. If the NYCTA wants to write law, then it needs to do so through the regulatory process, such as with a revision to its rules of conduct, not through a rate-making process. But yet again, in the NYCTA kangaroo adjudication forum, it seems unlikely that the administrative judges retained by the NYCTA would know much about public utility law and the role of tariffs. |
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| (335111) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Sun Jul 14 15:53:10 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Bill from Maspeth on Sun Jul 14 08:18:58 2019. The TV would have to be interested in it. I am sure they follow all the local papers and if they were interested, they would have contacted him. |
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| (335114) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by randyo on Sun Jul 14 21:04:24 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Sun Jul 14 12:23:42 2019. I don’t see anything preventing a wrongly “convicted” person from appealing outside the kangaroo court and directly to criminal court and I’m sure some enterprising ACLU lawyer would only be too glad to take the case. It’s interesting that only one hour is allowed from the time of issuance of the receipt especially during off hours with long headways when a passenger who just missed a but might run out of time by th time an inspector gets on board. As for faded ink, I once purchased a POP receipt at Newark Penn and the validation stamp was so light it was virtually unreadable yet the ticket was legit. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Mon Jul 15 03:21:35 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by randyo on Sun Jul 14 21:04:24 2019. The proper rule should be that it is the duty of the transit operators to prove that the proof-of-payment receipt had expired (or was otherwise invalid), and not the duty of the passenger to prove that it had not expired (or was otherwise valid). That would alleviate the concern over the lightly-printed validation stamp.When transit operators were private companies, the government generally took a pro-passenger perspective with respect to fare-related matters. With the government now being the transit operator, the policies have largely become anti-passenger. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jul 15 06:52:52 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by randyo on Sun Jul 14 21:04:24 2019. It costs $305 to file an Article 78 petition, which in most cases is higher than the fine, meaning that all that you would gain from doing so is a feeling of satisfaction if you win.The ACLU isn't going to waste time on something like that unless it has broader implications. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Edwards! on Mon Jul 15 07:57:00 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Mon Jul 15 03:21:35 2019. Yup..been there and done that.My wife and I successfully took on that same bastardized form of "justice" and "won" the case. ALL funds were returned,even monies that were stolen by the broken MVM. |
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| (335122) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jul 15 12:48:25 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Sat Jul 13 16:40:21 2019. Just as an aside: That tariff includes the list of special bus transfer rules that come up from time to time. |
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| (335123) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Nyctransitman on Mon Jul 15 14:40:54 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 13:10:59 2019. I think you meant B44SBS instead of Q44SBS. In any case I believe you could use the same SBS ticket to transfer to another branch of the same or similar route so for example if you first board a northbound Q52 bus in Arverne you could use that same ticket to transfer to a northbound Q53 bus for points further northwest of Queens Center such as Jackson Heights and Woodside or if you board a B44SBS bus at Knapp Street and need to travel to Williamsburg Bridge Plaza you could use the same SBS ticket to transfer to the other branch B44SBS to Williamburg Bridge Plaza or if you board a westbound M34A at Waterside Plaza and need to travel to 12th Avenue/34th Street rather than the Port Authority you could use the same ticket to transfer to a M34SBS bus to 12th Avenue/34th Street. |
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| (335124) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Kevin from Midwood on Mon Jul 15 15:27:40 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Fri Jul 12 13:10:59 2019. Re "an Unlimited Ride MetroCard cannot be used again at the same subway station or the same bus route for at least 18 minutes", an aside:Until recently it never occurred to me that the bus portion of those conditions is more restrictive than the subway portion. Using an unlimited, I purchased an SBS ticket on Kings Highway at West 7th. Then I walked to McDonald Ave and—still on the eastbound side of the street—tried to buy another and got a "JUST USED" message. Why is this not OK when I can swipe in at 18th Street on the 1, leave immediately, walk to 23rd, and swipe into the system again? If the goal is to deter passing the card back, an 18-minute lockout on the same bus or for the machines at the same SBS stop would suffice. |
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| (335125) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Mon Jul 15 15:29:45 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Nyctransitman on Mon Jul 15 14:40:54 2019. The Knapp St B44 SBS goes to Williamsburg Bridge Plaza. The example you should have used is if you board a B44 SBS north of Flushing Avenue going south, you should be able to use that ticket to board a B44 local south of Flushing. Don't know if it can be done, but that same ticket should entitle you to another bus transfer since that trip was possible for one fare when the Limited ran. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Jul 16 04:34:23 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Mon Jul 15 15:27:40 2019. Why would you have wanted another SBS ticket? |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jul 16 05:01:31 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jul 15 12:48:25 2019. Thanks for pointing that out. This was my first hearing about the Q17/30/31 maneuver. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 06:17:43 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Jul 16 04:34:23 2019. Probably testing the lockout policy. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jul 16 08:48:56 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Kevin from Midwood on Mon Jul 15 15:27:40 2019. On non-SBS routes you can't get on the same route during the lockout period no matter what stop it is, so it actually makes sense to me that they apply it to SBS routes too. I'm guessing the reason why they didn't bother with blocking nearby stations on the subway is that it wasn't worth the software and/or if people are willing to go to such trouble they would probably just wait out the 18 minutes anyway in many cases.Technically it is prohibited to pass along your unlimited card until you've completed your ride anyway, not that I've ever heard of that being enforced. |
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| (335133) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 12:18:58 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jul 16 05:01:31 2019. What's the deal with that one? All of the others preserve a connection that was severed by splitting a route in two, shortening a route, or providing one fare access to all of Staten Island. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by transitbuff on Tue Jul 16 12:20:35 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BrooklynBus on Sat Jul 13 04:56:52 2019. That case happened to me awhile back....I boarded B44 SBS at Willy B. Plaza...heading for Kings Highway.....traffic was exceedingly slow...when the bus reached Ave.L...a team boarded..as luck would have it, a female Eagle (not bald) asked for my ticket ...by then, one our already elapsed...so she asked me a whole bunch of idiotic questions.....finally I requested that she verify the leaving time with the bus operator ...This person seemed like a nitwit...then she exited.... |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by transitbuff on Tue Jul 16 12:26:08 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 06:17:43 2019. So, when DOES the SBS lockout clear? |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 12:41:34 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by transitbuff on Tue Jul 16 12:26:08 2019. I heard somewhere 36 minutes. That was back when the Bx12 was the only one, so it might be the standard 18 minutes now. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Tue Jul 16 13:04:21 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by transitbuff on Tue Jul 16 12:20:35 2019. This person seemed like a nitwitConsider the duties of the job of a receipt inspector. What type of cognitive abilities would you expect a person in that position to possess? Would not anyone with greater abilities seek out other employment that is more intellectually challenging? |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Pragmatist on Tue Jul 16 13:39:30 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Tue Jul 16 13:04:21 2019. That's a ridiculous statement. Many of the inspectors are retired LEO who are looking for a job to occupy time and make a few bucks. There are lots of reasons why people pick the jobs they pick, and plenty of people who are very bright and posess high leevels ability choose jobs that may not be associated with tht skill set. Lots of very highly educated and supposedly intelligent people are failures in the real world of work. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 13:57:07 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Mon Jul 15 06:52:52 2019. While there is a certain expense involved in filing an appeal, in most cases the petitioner can recoup any costs as part of the successful outcome of the case. As I remember reading several years ago if this is pursued as a civil rights case which it possibly could be, the petitioner is also entitled to be reimbursed for attorney’s fees as well. As for the ACLU not being interested, there is enough ant MTA sentiment in NY that the organization or an individual attorney within the organization might be quite interested in taking on the agency to try and set some precedents. |
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| (335140) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 14:00:41 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by New Flyer #857 on Tue Jul 16 08:48:56 2019. It would be impoaaible to enforce since the passengers’ names are not on the cards. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 14:11:28 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Pragmatist on Tue Jul 16 13:39:30 2019. Relative to clueless inspectors, a few years ago a friend of mt daughters was attending summer school at a Catholic institution. this was pre metrocard and when she displayed her pass, the driver refused to honor it because summer school did not start till the next day. It didn’t seem to matter ti the clueless excuse for a driver that while public school did not start till the next day her CATHOLIC school did start that day. The girls mother had to go with her the next day to insure the situation did nor recur. Unless a transit employee has an exhaustively encyclopedic knowledge of the hours, opening and closing dates of EVERY school in the city, he/she should remain silent as long as the pass is being used within the dates and times specified on the pass itself. |
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| (335142) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 14:11:40 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Pragmatist on Tue Jul 16 13:39:30 2019. Relative to clueless inspectors, a few years ago a friend of mt daughters was attending summer school at a Catholic institution. this was pre metrocard and when she displayed her pass, the driver refused to honor it because summer school did not start till the next day. It didn’t seem to matter ti the clueless excuse for a driver that while public school did not start till the next day her CATHOLIC school did start that day. The girls mother had to go with her the next day to insure the situation did nor recur. Unless a transit employee has an exhaustively encyclopedic knowledge of the hours, opening and closing dates of EVERY school in the city, he/she should remain silent as long as the pass is being used within the dates and times specified on the pass itself. |
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| (335143) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by BusMgr on Tue Jul 16 14:34:07 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 14:11:28 2019. I remember reading a study from a few years ago that came to the conclusion that you do not want people with high intelligence working as bus drivers. Such individuals get bored with the routine nature of the work, and their minds wander. In contrast, less intelligent individuals get more fully involved in such routine work, and more frequently focus their efforts on what is, to them, a challenging work environment. That work environment legitimately requires such attention, given the safety aspects involved, and the consequences of failing to pay attention. Such persons can be very good at this type of work. But that said, the reasoning ability of less-intelligent persons is not going to be that great: if it were otherwise, they would have a different career. So while the driver in this story might be very good, technically, at the skills required for driving, it is not surprising that he would not be able to reason through the distinctions between public schools and Catholic schools. |
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| (335144) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Pragmatist on Tue Jul 16 14:34:35 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 14:11:40 2019. There are plenty of clueless inspectors, no argument. My point is that there are plenty of people who aren't good at or suited for their jobs, and one's chosen occupation is often misconstrued as some sort of failing. There are just as many incompetent supervisors, managers executives and professionals, it just may not be as obvious. |
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| (335145) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 14:43:53 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by randyo on Tue Jul 16 13:57:07 2019. LOL! You are just so wrong. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Pragmatist on Tue Jul 16 15:16:18 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by BusMgr on Tue Jul 16 14:34:07 2019. focus is only one aspect of intelligence, there are brilliant people who have focus and/or attention defcit issues who may be useful in extremely complex problem solving, but only in short doses.... |
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| (335155) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by New Flyer #857 on Wed Jul 17 10:44:32 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Tue Jul 16 12:18:58 2019. I guess someone saw it as a way to make a virtual transfer between Hillside and Archer Aves, so that as far as transferring goes, getting to Archer is as good as getting to Hillside. |
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| (335156) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Jul 17 10:55:16 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by New Flyer #857 on Wed Jul 17 10:44:32 2019. I still don't understanding the logic behind it. I'll need to look at it again while also looking at a map. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Snilcher on Wed Jul 17 12:20:33 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Jul 17 10:55:16 2019. I suspect it's based on route history of the Q17 and Q30, but I'd have to know more about this special transfer facility before commenting further. Details? |
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| (335158) | |
Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Jul 17 12:28:53 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Snilcher on Wed Jul 17 12:20:33 2019. Page 61 (63rd page of PDF), et seq. |
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Re: SBS RULE |
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Posted by Snilcher on Wed Jul 17 13:11:20 2019, in response to Re: SBS RULE, posted by Spider-Pig on Wed Jul 17 12:28:53 2019. OK, I see it now. This is clearly to atone for a rerouting, but a more recent one than I had been thinking of. The buses that terminate at Merrick and Archer used to serve the 165th St. Terminal. Similarly, the Q27/Q83 transfer privilege evidently accommodates the former routing of the Q83 up Springfield Blvd. to Queens Village, now replaced by the extension of the Q27. |
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