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| TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? (199933) | |
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| (199935) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Mac5689 on Sun Jun 27 22:03:36 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. sounds to me like the City wants money, even if they have to go around the law/rule (which ever one you want to use) to get it. |
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| (199936) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Q101 E. MIDTOWN 2 AV on Sun Jun 27 22:09:20 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. I hoped Azumah used that subscription service thing from NYSDOT. |
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| (199950) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by BMTLines on Sun Jun 27 23:14:54 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. "We're not opposed to private serviceWhat a crock of BULLThe city has done everything in its power to destroy all private operators of transit from the IRT and BMT in 1940 to the Private Bus Companies two years ago. The city and state governments want to protect the government monopoly they now have. |
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| (199953) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by R40slantontheB on Sun Jun 27 23:31:12 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by BMTLines on Sun Jun 27 23:14:54 2010. And now I'm worried the same thing may happen in Suffolk. I miss Queens Surface, they really were a great operation. I feel the same way about CBS Lines, out in Suffolk, and already told the Director of Transportation in Suffolk over the phone I dont want the County or MTA to take over the private companies. |
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| (199961) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 28 00:18:40 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by R40slantontheB on Sun Jun 27 23:31:12 2010. You went to the fare hearings? |
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| (199971) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by R40slantontheB on Mon Jun 28 02:07:55 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by Osmosis Jones on Mon Jun 28 00:18:40 2010. Well I hope to be able to get to the 2nd one, but I called the number posted a couple of weeks ago and spoke to the Director of Transportation for Suffolk. He just listened to what I had to say, was mum about any takeovers or anything. |
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| (199976) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by JAzumah on Mon Jun 28 04:45:14 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. "We're not opposed to private service, but buses operating on our streets need to go through the process the right way and explain their routes, business plan, information on their bus fleet," a city official familiar with the matter said.Sounds like Franco Esposito. Remember June 2001? TNT Transportation almost sued the city for screwing with them. How quckly they forget. |
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| (199989) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by CapitalCruiser on Mon Jun 28 08:17:05 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. Good Luck Joel, let us know what's going on. We might want to take on the CDTA up here the same way. |
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| (200013) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by kcram3500 on Mon Jun 28 12:31:47 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Mon Jun 28 04:45:14 2010. Joel, you may want to give WCBS 880 a call and tell them how to spell your name...WCBS880.com - Private Buses Take Over Eliminated MTA Routes |
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| (200022) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by G1Ravage on Mon Jun 28 13:45:19 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by kcram3500 on Mon Jun 28 12:31:47 2010. Owner Joe Lazuma, however, insists his private charter is not subject to city rules.LOL |
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| (200023) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by 9 local on Mon Jun 28 13:54:01 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Mon Jun 28 04:45:14 2010. Here's a suggestion if you don't want the City to get on your case. DON'T USE THE OLD ROUTE DESIGNATIONS. |
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| (200035) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by lbt 9415 on Mon Jun 28 14:47:32 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Mon Jun 28 13:54:01 2010. I would agree. Use like a 2 or 3 digit route number...something thats unique. |
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| (200058) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by ctrabs74 on Mon Jun 28 18:35:37 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by kcram3500 on Mon Jun 28 12:31:47 2010. John Sterling probably did the proofreading for that story...In all seriousness, though, you would think that NYC would have better things to do than complain about an entrepreneur trying to fill a gap that the government-funded service created. I for one hopes this works out in Joel's favor. |
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| (200084) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Forest Glen on Mon Jun 28 23:29:39 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Mon Jun 28 04:45:14 2010. Fuck the DOT. You have my support! |
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| (200089) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Tue Jun 29 00:21:57 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. Unreal, did they pull this stunt with the 144? |
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| (200090) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Jun 29 00:24:46 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by NIMBYkiller on Tue Jun 29 00:21:57 2010. The 144 was operated with a different number. |
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| (200101) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by JAzumah on Tue Jun 29 05:03:39 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Mon Jun 28 13:54:01 2010. The city does not care about such things. When they harassed TNT in June 2001, they did not use route designations. When TNT's lawyers started tossing around paper, the city stopped. The city has done this same exact action before and nearly got sued. |
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| (200103) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by 9 local on Tue Jun 29 07:42:17 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Tue Jun 29 05:03:39 2010. Alright, but you're asking for it by using the MTA's numbers. They're not yours, you know. |
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| (200109) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Scrabbleship on Tue Jun 29 08:59:16 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by CapitalCruiser on Mon Jun 28 08:17:05 2010. Take CDTA on how? Doing service to areas that get too little service or running service they won't run?If the former: The corridor of the 129 up to Loudonville/Latham/Cohoes (which gets no night/weekend service) and the 118 to Delmar (whose lack of Sunday service is an annoyance to many) would be ripe for the picking. So would a lot of the rural towns that pay into CDTA but get nothing. Something that hits the train station with more frequency than the 214 would also be good. This is CDTA, I could go on forever... If the latter: What you're doing now (taking on the 11 for the weekend bar crowd but lasting past 2:00 AM) is excellent. |
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| (200124) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by CapitalCruiser on Tue Jun 29 11:35:21 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by Scrabbleship on Tue Jun 29 08:59:16 2010. CDTA is married to Upstate Transit, pumping them with runs and money and buses and they won't let anyone else in on the deal. Shoot, I'll bet you the new garage they plan on building in Saratoga will benefit Upstate a great deal and I'll bet they end up runing all the Saratoga buses in the future. They already run the NX, along with the shuttle out on 155, 20Mall and Central Ave. I enquired about CDTA putting services up for bid and they pretty much laughed at me saying they don't put runs up for bid, so basically, Upstate get's it all. I remember when the old Troy 5th Ave operated the Rural buses (Hoosick Falls and Berlin), Harvey Dubb operated the Albany county rural buses, and Upstate Operated the Saratoga county buses after CDtA gave up the Northway Flyer service. They all were given CDTA buses and operating money and made a decent living off those route, then CDTA came in, took them back, screwed them all up and ending up terrorizing the riders and eventually disbanded alot of the services. Look at the Hoosick Falls route, 2 companies operated it and there basically no advertisement for the service which could be a GOLD MINE if it were marketed the right way. Shoot, CDTA once gave Yankee Trails 2 new buses and no money to keep them up, and they never got buses again, even tho they bought Upstate 15 MCI's and 2 Gillig Hybrids! See where I'm going with this? Upstate is in CDTA's pocket and no one else can have a piece of the pie! Watch out, because I'm planning something that knock their socks off, very soon! |
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| (200125) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by brightonr68 on Tue Jun 29 12:03:48 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by CapitalCruiser on Tue Jun 29 11:35:21 2010. How much does Upstate transit contribute to the local senators and other elected officials. Its all about bribes in NYS |
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| (200126) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by BusMgr on Tue Jun 29 12:24:34 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Tue Jun 29 07:42:17 2010. Alright, but you're asking for it by using the MTA's numbers. They're not yours, you know.If it is possible to have a property right (i.e., a trademark) in the alpha-numeric route designation scheme (a doubtful proposition at best), then the question becomes to whom do those alpha-numeric designations belong? The scheme was instituted in New York by the City's Board of Estimate, and the use ot the scheme by NYCTA was with the approval and consent of the Board of Estimate. After the Board's demise the City continued to use the scheme, through its Department of Transportation, and it continues to do so. Meanwhile, NYCTA stopped getting approval to use the City's scheme (and MTAB never received approval from the City). Might NYCTA have acquired the property through adverse possession? Through the term sheet with the City might MTAB have acquired the property? I suspect neither and that NYCTA and MTAB simply appropriated the alpha-numeric designations for themselves. In any event, this is all irrelevant if, as I believe, the alpha-numeric route designations are not trademarks. They're simply descriptive geographic terms without secondary meaning and therefore cannot be trademarks. |
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| (200129) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by kcram3500 on Tue Jun 29 12:48:34 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by BusMgr on Tue Jun 29 12:24:34 2010. In addition, if there was any ownership/registration of route numbers by the city and/or MTA, one would imagine they would have had something to say about MegaBus and their Mxx route numbers being used in Manhattan.Many of the New Jersey IBOAs took on Public Service/Transport of New Jersey by using the exact same route numbers to compete on the same route. In the early 70s, the combination of TNJ and South Orange Avenue IBOA resulted in service on the 31 every *2* minutes during rush hours. |
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| (200130) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by JohnnyMints on Tue Jun 29 13:17:03 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by kcram3500 on Tue Jun 29 12:48:34 2010. Many of the New Jersey IBOAs took on Public Service/Transport of New Jersey by using the exact same route numbers to compete on the same route. In the early 70s, the combination of TNJ and South Orange Avenue IBOA resulted in service on the 31 every *2* minutes during rush hours.Kind of like the relationship between the 126 and Red Apple (later Academy) before the private Washington service was discontinued... Do you think NJ will see a return of this sort of service model, or a return of the IBOA model, being that NJT has cut bus service in a lot of places? How exactly did the IBOA model work? My understanding is that basically, each driver was an independent contractor and they pooled their resources to operate the route... the contractors owned their own buses and could hire drivers to drive them... is this correct at all? That's sort of how the FedEx Ground system works. In any case, I know the "Spanish Buses" slaughtered many of the Hudson County routes, as well as the 171 and to a lesser extent the 74. The 190 is still going strong, but some service has been scaled back recently (gutting of Delawanna service on weekends for example). |
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| (200132) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by kcram3500 on Tue Jun 29 13:42:27 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JohnnyMints on Tue Jun 29 13:17:03 2010. You have the IBOA model correct, but at the time the IBOAs were in their glory years (60s and 70s), buses and operating costs were not prohibitively priced. Local bus service today is a money-losing proposition, so in order to offer competitive fares, a private operator would want subsidies to fill in the gap - this is why companies like Academy and Coach USA pursue NJT contracts. The few routes they run on their own are propped up by their own profitable services and the ability to lease buses from NJT for $1. In comparison, the new NABI 416s are $348K each... $12 over a 12-year term definitely cuts your expenses. |
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| (200159) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by CapitalCruiser on Tue Jun 29 16:31:45 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by brightonr68 on Tue Jun 29 12:03:48 2010. YOU GOT THAT RIGHT! |
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| (200164) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 29 16:43:16 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JohnnyMints on Tue Jun 29 13:17:03 2010. Isn't the 190 the only New Jersey Transit route in Northern New Jersey that runs 24/7 along with the 62? |
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| (200172) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by B53RICH on Tue Jun 29 18:42:44 2010, in response to TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by GOLD_12th on Sun Jun 27 21:44:24 2010. Saw the news report on Ch. 11 PIX News last night. I can't find a PIX News web story to post. |
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| (200189) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by metrolinecoach111 on Tue Jun 29 22:00:26 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 29 16:43:16 2010. That would be in addition to the 128 and the 159. |
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| (200202) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Tue Jun 29 23:21:34 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by metrolinecoach111 on Tue Jun 29 22:00:26 2010. New Jersey Transit got on its knees and handed its late night 128 service to the commuter vans. |
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| (200205) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by JohnnyMints on Tue Jun 29 23:49:47 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by kcram3500 on Tue Jun 29 13:42:27 2010. So who actually owned the IBOA routes? Were they owned by the state, or did all the contractors partially own them? |
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| (200219) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by kcram3500 on Wed Jun 30 07:26:00 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JohnnyMints on Tue Jun 29 23:49:47 2010. Unlike New York, in New Jersey each company owns its routes. There are no franchises handed out by a government department. If two companies are competing, they both have ownership of it. NJ Transit operates as a private company in this regard; they get no special treatment for being a public corporation. Any company that thinks they can do better than NJT on one of their routes can start service against them. There are a few "treaty" agreements where established companies have agreed to stay out of each other's territories, but not much else. |
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| (200291) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Mr RT on Thu Jul 1 07:02:08 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Tue Jun 29 05:03:39 2010. The City DOT has a full time job dealing with "traffic", so they don't want to get involved with this, but if they get a call from Mayor Mike, they have to do something. |
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| (200307) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by JAzumah on Thu Jul 1 09:38:21 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Tue Jun 29 07:42:17 2010. Who runs the X23 and X24? It isn't the MTA.You will also notice that it isn't the MTA crying. The MTA (secretly) wants this to work. If there is a chance that they can offload services they don't want to run instead of leaving a void, they will do it. |
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| (200311) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by 9 local on Thu Jul 1 09:58:47 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by JAzumah on Thu Jul 1 09:38:21 2010. IIRC the X23 and X24 are MTA routes contracted out to Atlantic Express. They are on the bus map, they accept MetroCard, and Staten Islanders are crying out for the MTA to take them in-house. The comparison does not work. |
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| (200327) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by The Flxible Neofan on Thu Jul 1 11:30:36 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Thu Jul 1 09:58:47 2010. Why are people so upset with Atlantic Express? |
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| (200356) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by 9 local on Thu Jul 1 13:16:25 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by The Flxible Neofan on Thu Jul 1 11:30:36 2010. From what I've heard, sometimes, if there are only a few passengers on board, the bus suddenly "breaks down" before it reaches the Lincoln Tunnel. Plus, until recently, they used lots of old buses on that route (these have since been retired and replaced by VanHools). |
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| (200411) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by Osmosis Jones on Thu Jul 1 18:23:47 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Thu Jul 1 13:16:25 2010. That's what happens when you contract a school bus company to run transit operations. |
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| (200436) | |
Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service? |
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Posted by NIMBYkiller on Thu Jul 1 20:10:24 2010, in response to Re: TransportAzumah may need to obtain city franchise to operate private bus service?, posted by 9 local on Thu Jul 1 13:16:25 2010. Haha I remember some of the old busted ass Setras they used to run on it. |
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