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| Nostrand Avenue BRT concept (173423) | |
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| (173423) | |
Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by ntrainride on Tue Nov 17 00:40:17 2009 Probably not news to you guys but I hadn't heard about it. |
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| (173453) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by Pablo M 201 on Tue Nov 17 09:37:30 2009, in response to Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by ntrainride on Tue Nov 17 00:40:17 2009. A few weeks ago I was riding the B44 on Nostrand Avenue south of Brooklyn College and I really don't see +SBS+ working there unless they do away with parking, which in turn, what do you do with all the cars that can't park there? Nostand Avenue is way too narrow south of Flatbush Avenue for this kind of service. The MTA got alot on their plate with this one..... |
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| (173457) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by ntrainride on Tue Nov 17 10:19:53 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Pablo M 201 on Tue Nov 17 09:37:30 2009. Yeah, it's hard to see how the service could be implemented on most NY streets, barring a big infrastructure investment. |
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| (173460) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by Dan on Tue Nov 17 10:40:52 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by ntrainride on Tue Nov 17 10:19:53 2009. The parking issue, among other things, is what killed the BRT on Hylan Blvd. The proposal was insane. Apparently in some sections the Hylan Blvd median was going to be widened and used as the BRT corridor for the S79. BRT passengers would be right out in the middle of Hylan Blvd. In other sections the parking lane was to be eliminated which would hurt local stores dependent on on-street customer parking.This would have taken traffic lanes away from the regular local buses and the express buses. It made no sense and was opposed by every S.I. elected official of both parties. It's under "review" by the NYCDOT and MTA but is really a dead issue now. |
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| (173461) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by (SIR) North Shore Line on Tue Nov 17 10:46:39 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Dan on Tue Nov 17 10:40:52 2009. IMO, the MTA should simply create a S79 Limited when Charleston opens up. |
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| (173464) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by B49 Limited on Tue Nov 17 11:09:11 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Pablo M 201 on Tue Nov 17 09:37:30 2009. I am still hoping for the B 44 SBS to be shot down like what happened in Queens but after getting the Pokey awards, it is possible that it gave the MTA more reasons to create it.As for the B 44 SBS, people will be complaining now because the B 44 Limited did put you directly to Kings County Hospital, now passengers will be forced to be using the local bus because many would complain that the SBS will put them too far away and waiting for the B 12 can sometimes feel like forever. The second problem is that certain parts of the route in both directions will have either narrow roads or traffic bottleneck. On northbound service, Flatbush Av between Glenwwod and Nostrand is going to be a delay and creating a lane would not help the cause. The traffic pattern at Glenwood/Flatbush and at the Junction is too complicated (and still needs work). Also Rogers Av between Church Av - Linden Blvd is a bottleneck, and between Empire Blvd and Eastern Pky, is too narrow where traffic can be slow during the PM hours. On Nostrand Av there is too narrow between Atlantic Av - Sullivan Pl. And like Rogers Av between Linden Blvd - Church Av the traffic can go into a snail. Then lets not mention the College Junction again... I think service improvements will need to be made on not just the B 44 local but also the B 49. I would even consider extending the B 49 to Williamsburg/Flushing Av to assist the B 44. I don't think SBS is needed for B44 but improvement in the traffic pattern could help the route. |
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| (173492) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by mike nash on Tue Nov 17 16:36:49 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Tue Nov 17 11:09:11 2009. I'm a 44 rider i believe that diverting off ny ave to rogers/bedford is a huge mistake your by passing the projects at ave d, Also not seving the a/c station which is a major trafficgenerator. eliminating stops at glenwood rd/ ave d/ bergen st/gates ave/ mytle ave are mistakes and the service level could be reduced dasticly, could be as much as 25-33% especially rush hours am 4/6, pm 5/7.5. I like the idea of quicker service but not by elinating so meny possible riders especailly northbound. |
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| (173498) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Nov 17 17:49:03 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Dan on Tue Nov 17 10:40:52 2009. Why would you want BRT on a street that parallels SIRT. Why not just improve access to SIRT to get more people to use it? |
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| (173499) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Nov 17 17:54:47 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Tue Nov 17 11:09:11 2009. Some of the reasons you give are why I never thought the B$4 was the best route to choose in Brooklyn. I suggested the B82, but using Avenue P instead of the narrow Kings Highway and turning at Avenue K. That route would use only streets that are four lanes wide plus parking lanes. But they wouldn't listen to me because they are the "experts." Ha Ha! |
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| (173506) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 19:05:43 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Nov 17 17:54:47 2009. I totally agree with you. The B82 would be a better line for SBS. It's a very long line that should have SBS so that it doesn't have to make so many stops. Also yes Av P would be much better than Kings Highway west of Ocean Av. |
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| (173507) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by JAzumah on Tue Nov 17 19:06:34 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by BrooklynBus on Tue Nov 17 17:49:03 2009. Someone else who understands. The only rail line in this region treated worse than SIR is the Greenport-Ronkonkoma service. |
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| (173509) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Nov 17 19:09:34 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 19:05:43 2009. The problem with Avenue P is that it misses a major transfer point with the subway. I doubt people will want to walk an extra block for a transfer that they had, but now have lost. |
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| (173511) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 19:12:48 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by mike nash on Tue Nov 17 16:36:49 2009. Agreed, if anything they should switch the B44 and B49 routes going n/b. |
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| (173546) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by B49 Limited on Tue Nov 17 23:30:40 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 19:12:48 2009. I agree with you and if that is the case implement B 49 limited service northbound to Empire Blvd also. |
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| (173549) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by Grand Concourse on Tue Nov 17 23:42:23 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Tue Nov 17 23:30:40 2009. Yup. At least that way everyone will at least get service as similar as possible. |
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| (173550) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 00:13:17 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by AMoreira81 on Tue Nov 17 19:09:34 2009. The major stations effected by the B 82 SBS via Av P is the Kings Hwy Stations along the Sea Beach and Brighton lines. The Culver line is covered since there is a station at Ave P.I can't figure out a solution for connection to the Sea Beach line (N) but in a previous thread promoting the idea of B 82 limited or SBS, I consider doing a loop at the Kings Hwy Station similar to Rockaway Pky: Both buses would use the bus stop created on E 16 st next to the Chase Bank.. Spring Creek bound buses would run via Av P, E 16 St, Quentin Rd, Ocean Av (bus stop station at Ocean Av/Quentin Rd), and return back to Kings Hwy Coney Island buses would continue along AV P then go via E 16 St, Kings Hwy, E 15 ST, and return back to AV P. Overall,SBS service has to many flaws in the outer boros.I think Bx12 SBS was a good concept, but I heard there were complains for business along Fordham Rd. Brooklyn has too many narrow roads make it so challenging and difficult to implement a full route SBS service. Look at the B 35 Limited for example or look at the B 46 between Empire Blvd and Atlantic Av. perfect examples of why SBS would be difficult. Unless there strong traffic enforcement, there are no guarantees for success. I also have a concern about farebeaters taking advantage of the SBS service, as I realized while riding the Bx12 SBS. Farebeating seems to happen more these days and bases on what I see on the Bx12, I can tell that even someone enforcing the stops (months later when the route is implemented and not just the first couple of weeks) that it would become a bigger issue. On the flip side of SBS, if certain portions of the route was implemented (for example, if SBS on the B 46 was implemented between Eastern Pkwy and Avenue H or Kings Plaza or a retro B 50 SBS - between Kings Hwy Sta and Spring Creek/Gateway Center or Seaview Av) I think there are some success. Here is an SBS idea I also considered: B 27 SBS (named after route NY 27) JFK - Bay Ridge SBS via Ft. Hamilton Pkwy/Caton Av/ Linden Blvd/ Conduit Blvd. the route could extend to Green Acres. Biggest Flaw: is Caton Av and Linden Blvd now reduced to one lane between Kings Hwy and New York Av due to turning bay. To be honest I rather see the city and MTA convert the old LIRR routes like the Bay Ridge line to either LRT or another subway line. |
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| (173551) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 00:17:24 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by JAzumah on Tue Nov 17 19:06:34 2009. I have to agree 100%... |
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| (173559) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by JAzumah on Wed Nov 18 02:31:54 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 00:13:17 2009. "Biggest Flaw: is Caton Av and Linden Blvd now reduced to one lane between Kings Hwy and New York Av due to turning bay."One of the biggest traffic improvements in Brooklyn this year. Emergency vehicles can get through and traffic flows a lot better. It has also reduced the accidents on my corner. |
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| (173567) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by BrooklynBus on Wed Nov 18 08:18:17 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 00:13:17 2009. You make a lot of good points here. I just want to add that I don't think you need SBS on the B46. It was a long time ago but I used to use it every day in the 1960s between Empir e Blvd and I thought the only thing it needed was enforcement. On the narrow portion there was No Standing to maintain two lanes of traffic between Carroll and Eastern Pkwy. On days where there were no cars parked, it took two or three minutes for the few blocks during the morning rush. . If even only one car was there, it took 8 minutes. |
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| (173576) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 10:50:36 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by JAzumah on Wed Nov 18 02:31:54 2009. In terms of safety you are absolutely correct. The traffic improvement along Linden Blvd is great. In terms of SBS, I can see a lot of problems because the lack of a lane and the removal of parking would be a rise for people against an SBS route. |
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| (173750) | |
Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept |
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Posted by SuBbus aka ENY Local on Fri Nov 20 02:11:59 2009, in response to Re: Nostrand Avenue BRT concept, posted by B49 Limited on Wed Nov 18 10:50:36 2009. Empire Blvd is one lane in each direction between Troy and Nostrand Aves. Traffic so far have been running smooth on that stretch of Empire Blvd as well........ |
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